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April 8th, 2005 Trial Analysis: Adrian McManus (Cross Examination) and Phillip LeMarque (Direct & Cross Examination), Part 1 of 3

December 18, 2012

Adrian McManus’s cross examination continued today, and Mesereau continued to grill her about her knowledge of the lawsuit that she and four other Neverland employees filed against Jackson on December 2nd, 1994.  For example, in her lawsuit she included the fact that she was a potential material witness against Jackson in both his criminal and civil trial, and Mesereau asked McManus if her goal in stating this in the lawsuit was to insinuate that she would change her testimony into something negative against Jackson unless she was paid, but McManus wasn’t “familiar” with that language in the lawsuit. She also wasn’t “familiar” with the total amount of money she wanted from Jackson, and she even stated that a simple apology from Jackson would have sufficed! 

14 CROSS-EXAMINATION (Continued)

 

15 BY MR. MESEREAU:

 

16 Q. Ms. McManus, your — excuse me.

 

17 Ms. McManus, your deposition in the Chandler

 

18 lawsuit was on December 7th, 1993, right?

 

19 A. Correct.

 

20 Q. And the Complaint you filed against Michael

 

21 Jackson, along with Ralph Chacon, was December 2nd,

 

22 1994, a year later, approximately a year later,

 

23 right?

 

24 A. I believe so.

 

25 Q. Okay. Would it refresh your recollection

 

26 just to take a look at the Complaint?

 

27 A. Sure.

 

28 MR. MESEREAU: May I approach, Your Honor? 5398

 

1 THE COURT: Yes.

 

2 THE WITNESS: Okay. Yeah.

 

3 MR. MESEREAU: Thank you.

 

4 Q. Now, in that lawsuit, you were suing Mr.

 

5 Jackson for a number of different claims, and one of

 

6 the claims talked about you having appeared at a

 

7 deposition taken by Larry Feldman, and the claim

 

8 said that you were a potential material witness

 

9 against Jackson in both the civil suit and a

 

10 criminal investigation, right?

 

11 A. I believe so.

 

12 Q. And what that really meant was, by filing

 

13 that Complaint with that language, you were

 

14 essentially threatening Mr. Jackson that you would

 

15 change your testimony unless you were paid, right?

 

16 A. I’m not familiar with a lot of attorney

 

17 language, so I really don’t know how to answer that.

 

18 Q. How much money do you recall you were

 

19 seeking from Mr. Jackson in that lawsuit?

 

20 A. That’s another question I cannot answer.

 

21 That was dealing with my attorney.

 

22 Q. Well, you were in court when he argued to

 

23 the Santa Maria jury for millions of dollars, right?

 

24 A. I don’t even know if I was there at that

 

25 time. I could have been. I don’t remember.

 

26 Q. You certainly must have discussed with your

 

27 attorney during that six-month trial how much money

 

28 you were trying to get for yourself from Mr. 5399

 

1 Jackson, right?

 

2 A. Honestly, I don’t believe anybody knew how

 

3 much money anybody would be getting out of a trial.

 

4 Q. But how much did you want?

 

5 A. I really didn’t want anything. I just

 

6 wanted justice for what I had gone through.

 

7 Q. You didn’t want millions of dollars in that

 

8 lawsuit?

 

9 A. I wanted justice. I didn’t — whatever — I

 

10 wanted justice.

 

11 Q. But your idea of justice was millions of

 

12 bucks, right?

 

13 A. Well, that’s not what I call justice.

 

14 Q. You file a lawsuit, you go through

 

15 approximately eight days of depositions, all sorts

 

16 of paperwork, and you’re in trial for six months.

 

17 You wanted millions, right?

 

18 A. Honestly, a simple “Sorry for what we did to

 

19 you” would have been great for me.

 

20 Q. Did you ever write a letter to Mr. Jackson

 

21 saying, “Mr. Jackson, I don’t want to sue you. Just

 

22 tell me you’re sorry”?

 

23 A. No, I did not.

 

24 Q. Ever call Mr. Jackson and say, “Mr. Jackson,

 

25 I don’t really want to sue you. Just say you’re

 

26 sorry”?

 

27 A. I didn’t have a number to contact Mr.

 

28 Jackson. 5400

Next, Mesereau questioned McManus about whether her statements to police about seeing misconduct by Jackson were said to gain leverage against Jackson in her lawsuit, and if her statements to tabloids were also meant to pressure Jackson into settling out of court:

1 Q. Okay. When did you first go to the police

 

2 to tell them you had seen anything improper about

 

3 Mr. Jackson?

 

4 A. I can’t recall the date. I don’t remember.

 

5 Q. It was after your deposition in the Chandler

 

6 case, correct?

 

7 A. It might have been.

 

8 Q. Do you know approximately when you first

 

9 talked to anyone from the Santa Barbara Sheriff’s

 

10 Department about your claim that you’d seen Mr.

 

11 Jackson do anything improper?

 

12 A. You know, it might have been when I talked

 

13 to my attorney, Mr. Ring. It might have been

 

14 sometime then, that I can recall.

 

15 Q. And when you did that, you thought going to

 

16 the sheriffs would put pressure on Mr. Jackson to

 

17 pay money in your civil case, right?

 

18 A. No, I did not.

 

19 Q. Did you go to the sheriffs with your

 

20 attorney?

 

21 A. I don’t believe so.

 

22 Q. But certainly you went to an attorney before

 

23 anyone from law enforcement, right?

 

24 A. Actually, I recall going to law enforcement

 

25 to com — to complain about the death threat that I

 

26 got from James Van Norman and strange circumstances

 

27 that were going on at Neverland Valley Ranch.

 

28 Q. But that was also to bolster your claim for 5401

 

1 millions of dollars, right?

 

2 A. That was before I even contacted an

 

3 attorney.

 

4 Q. But by doing that, you were setting the

 

5 stage for a lawsuit for millions of dollars against

 

6 Mr. Jackson, correct?

 

7 A. No, I was not.

 

8 Q. You went to tabloids, a lawyer, and the

 

9 sheriffs, all to get millions of bucks, right?

 

10 A. You’re wrong.

 

11 MR. ZONEN: Objection; compound.

 

12 THE COURT: The answer was, “You’re wrong.”

 

13 Overruled. Next question.

McManus was next questioned about exculpatory statements that she made about Jackson to several coworkers of hers, which she denied during yet another convenient case of amnesia:

14 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Do you know Leslie Gomez?

 

15 A. No, I don’t.

 

16 Q. Do you know she was the manager of

 

17 McFrugal’s?

 

18 A. I think I know her as Beaver. That’s the

 

19 name I think I’m thinking of.

 

20 Q. You told her you had never seen Michael

 

21 Jackson act inappropriately with children, right?

 

22 A. I’ve never talked to her about Michael

 

23 Jackson.

 

24 Q. You told Leslie Gomez that, “The suit by

 

25 that kid,” meaning Mr. Chandler, “was a bunch of

 

26 bull,” right?

 

27 A. I’ve never told — I’ve never talked to her

 

28 about anything to do with lawsuits or anything with 5402

 

1 Mr. Jackson.

 

2 Q. And do you know someone named Ludi Trujillo?

 

3 A. Yes, I do.

 

4 Q. Ludi Trujillo is your former boss at

 

5 Gottschalk’s, right?

 

6 A. No, she was not.

 

7 Q. Who is she?

 

8 A. She’s a girl that worked at Gottschalk’s.

 

9 Just a lady.

 

10 Q. She didn’t have any position above you?

 

11 A. No, she did not.

 

12 Q. Okay. You talked to her about the Chandler

 

13 lawsuit, didn’t you?

 

14 A. No, I did not.

 

15 Q. She asked you specifically if Mr. Jackson

 

16 ever molested children, and you told her, “Of course

 

17 Michael did not,” right?

 

18 A. No, I did not.

 

19 Q. You told her Michael Jackson was a great

 

20 boss, didn’t you?

 

21 A. No, I did not.

 

22 Q. Do you know someone named Jamie Vail?

 

23 A. No, I don’t.

 

24 Q. Didn’t Jamie Vail live across the street

 

25 from you?

 

26 A. Where was this? I don’t know the name.

 

27 Q. Okay. Do you remember telling someone named

 

28 Jamie Vail that you loved Michael Jackson, you love 5403

 

1 working at the ranch, and you never believed any of

 

2 the charges against him?

 

3 A. I don’t even know that person.

 

4 Q. Okay. Do you know who Gayle Goforth is?

 

5 A. Yes, I do.

 

6 Q. And who is Gayle Goforth?

 

7 A. She was a supervisor that worked at

 

8 Neverland Valley Ranch.

 

9 Q. Do you remember Gayle asked you if there was

 

10 anything to rumors about inappropriate conduct by

 

11 Mr. Jackson?

12 A. She never — we never talked about that, no.

 

13 Q. In the autumn of 1993, you told her there

 

14 was no truth to those rumors about Mr. Jackson

 

15 acting inappropriately, right?

 

16 A. No, I did not.

Next, McManus denied plotting with other Neverland employees to sell stories to the tabloids, other than the stories they sold at the advice of their attorney Michael Ring after their lawsuit was filed.

17 Q. Now, you and Ralph Chacon and Kassim Abdool

 

18 started meeting secretly at Neverland to talk about

 

19 your lawsuit, didn’t you?

 

20 A. No, we did not.

 

21 Q. You and Ralph Chacon and Kassim Abdool began

 

22 to meet at Neverland to discuss the possibility of

 

23 selling stories to the media, right?

 

24 A. No, we did not.

 

25 Q. Did you ever discuss selling a story to the

 

26 media with Ralph Chacon?

 

27 A. No, I did not.

 

28 Q. When you were working at Neverland, did you 5404

 

1 ever learn that Ralph Chacon was thinking of selling

 

2 any story about Michael Jackson to the media?

 

3 A. No.

 

4 Q. When did you first hear anything about Ralph

 

5 Chacon’s willingness to go to the media with

 

6 information about Michael Jackson?

 

7 A. The only time that we all sold a story was

 

8 when we were already in our lawsuit with Mr.

 

9 Jackson, which was with Mr. Ring, our attorney.

 

10 Q. Now, at some point, you learned that Blanca

 

11 Francia had sold a story to Hard Copy, correct?

 

12 A. Yes.

 

13 Q. She sold her information before you sold

 

14 yours, right?

 

15 A. I don’t recall when Bianca — Blanca sold

 

16 the story.

 

17 Q. Do you know someone named Charli Michaels?

 

18 A. Yes, I do.

 

19 Q. Who is Charli Michaels?

 

20 A. She was a security guard for Neverland

 

21 Valley Ranch.

 

22 Q. Did you ever hear information that Charli

 

23 Michaels was trying to sell a story about Michael

 

24 Jackson to the media?

 

25 A. No, I did not.

 

26 Q. To date, have you ever heard anything about

 

27 that?

 

28 A. No. 5405

 

1 Q. Ever have a discussion with Charli Michaels

 

2 about the possibility of making money from

 

3 information you’d learned at Neverland?

 

4 A. No. I only recall talking to Charli about

 

5 her having sexual harassment with people at the

 

6 ranch.

 

7 Q. Okay. So you and she never said anything

 

8 about the possibility of making a buck from the

 

9 media, correct?

 

10 A. No. No.

 

11 Q. Okay. Now, when you were at Neverland, you

 

12 learned that security guards at the Encino home of

 

13 the Jacksons on Havenhurst had sold stories for

 

14 approximately $100,000, right?

 

15 A. No, I never heard that.

 

16 Q. You knew they had sold stories about Michael

 

17 Jackson, didn’t you?

 

18 A. No.

 

19 MR. ZONEN: I’m going to object as asked and

 

20 answered.

 

21 THE COURT: Sustained.

 

22 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Do you know someone named

 

23 Francine Orosco?

 

24 A. Yes, I do.

 

25 Q. And who is Francine Orosco?

 

26 A. She was a maid for Neverland Valley Ranch.

 

27 Q. And at some point, she was a personal friend

 

28 of yours, was she not? 5406

 

1 A. We became friends, yes.

 

2 Q. Now, you knew that she became a witness

 

3 against your claims in the lawsuit, right?

 

4 A. Yes, I believe so.

 

5 Q. She said you were never sexually harassed by

 

6 anybody, right?

 

7 MR. ZONEN: I’ll object as hearsay.

 

8 THE COURT: Sustained.

 

9 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Didn’t you repeatedly tell

 

10 Francine Orosco that Michael Jackson was innocent of

 

11 any charge of molestation?

 

12 A. No, I did not.

 

13 Q. Do you remember telling Francine Orosco that

 

14 you were going to get big-time money in your lawsuit

 

15 against Michael Jackson?

 

16 A. No, I did not.

 

17 Q. And you tried to convince her to say that

 

18 she had seen acts of sexual harassment involving

 

19 you, right?

 

20 A. No, I did not.

Francine Orosco Contreras testified against McManus for the defense on May 9th, 2005, and she thoroughly annihilated McManus’s credibility! She also defended Jackson in 1993; here is an excerpt of an interview of hers that was transcribed in Ian Halperin’s book “Unmasked”, on pages 71-72, in which she refuted Blanca Francia:

Meanwhile, two other former Neverland housekeepers came forward to discredit Francia’s allegations, telling CNN that the stories were made up.

“I think it’s ridiculous,” declared Shanda Lujan, who worked at Neverland for almost a year. “I mean, there’s no way that Michael could that. Michael’s just not that type of person.”

Francin Orosco worked for Jackson for two years and also said Jackson was incapable of the kind of behavior he was being accused of. “I think it’s pure lies. I think it’s just pure lies. It’s disgusting what they – what they could accuse somebody of for, and I think it’s just all for money. Michael could never do something like that. Never, ever.”

Both Orosco and Lujan claimed that Francia had actually been fired because of a bad attitude and was obsessed with the pop superstar.

“You could tell a lot that she had a little crush on him. And very jealous of the other housekeepers and didn’t want no one close to Michael. There was…there’s a lot of jealousy there,” said Orosco.

“He was great with kids,” added Lujan. “I mean, you know, if…I think he would be a very good father. I mean, he’s just wonderful with them.” The former maids said their ranch chores involved entering Jackson’s room at times, but that they had never seen anything suspicious.

Most notable about their statements was that at the time of their interviews, each of the two women were no longer on Jackson’s payroll and were not paid for their interviews, and therefore had no incentive to lie.

During her employment at Neverland, McManus stole lots of items from Neverland (such as posters, watches, clocks, sunglasses, etc.), in addition to Jackson’s sketch of Elvis Presley (which was sold to a tabloid). The jury ruled that all of those items had been stolen by McManus, although she continued to deny it:

21 Q. While you worked at Neverland, Francine

 

22 Orosco visited you at home, did she not?

 

23 A. Maybe one time.

 

24 Q. And you showed her a room in your house

 

25 filled with watches, posters, clocks, sunglasses,

 

26 T-shirts and other items you had taken from

 

27 Neverland, correct?

 

28 A. No. 5407

 

1 Q. You showed her laundry baskets filled with

 

2 Michael Jackson’s clothes that you had taken from

 

3 Neverland, right?

 

4 A. No, I did not.

 

5 Q. Do you remember one time at Neverland when a

 

6 box of black felt hats came for Mr. Jackson?

 

7 A. I can’t recall that.

 

8 Q. Do you remember that box of hats had Michael

 

9 Jackson’s name printed on the inside of the rim of

 

10 the hats?

 

11 A. I know he had hats, but I don’t recall the

 

12 hats being sent there.

 

13 Q. Do you remember taking a hat and saying you

 

14 were going to bring it home?

 

15 A. No.

 

16 Q. Now, you used to take food home from the

 

17 theater, did you not?

 

18 A. Food, like what are you talking about?

 

19 Dinners?

 

20 Q. Candy?

 

21 A. No.

 

22 Q. Never took bags of candy home?

 

23 A. There was a time when — you say “take,”

 

24 you’re saying like — you’re saying I’m just going

 

25 to take it, that is not correct.

 

26 There was a time when Gayle Goforth, a

 

27 supervisor, went down to the theater and took a lot

 

28 of the candy from there, because it was expired. 5408

 

1 She brought it back to the maids, the maids’ room,

 

2 and she let all the maids take candy that was

 

3 expired. She also gave it to security. That was

 

4 the only time.

 

5 Q. So you never stole any candy from Michael

 

6 Jackson?

 

7 A. No, I did not.

 

8 Q. Do you remember around Christmastime when

 

9 you worked at Neverland, Mr. Jackson used to

 

10 purchase toys for needy children?

 

11 A. I believe he did.

 

12 Q. And they tended to be fairly expensive toys,

 

13 did they not?

 

14 A. I really don’t know.

 

15 Q. You took some of those toys home, did you

 

16 not?

 

17 A. No, I did not. That was Janelle Wahl.

 

18 Q. Pardon me?

 

19 A. That was Janelle Wahl that would take that.

 

20 Q. You never took any Super Soaker guns home?

 

21 A. No, sir.

 

22 Q. Now, these are the kinds of things the jury

 

23 found that you had actually done, correct?

 

24 A. I don’t believe so.

 

25 Q. Well, they found that you had stolen from

 

26 Mr. Jackson, correct?

 

27 A. I believe it was what they thought I had

 

28 stolen was that sketch that I found in the trash. 5409

 

1 Q. And you’re saying you didn’t steal that

 

2 either, right?

3 A. I didn’t. I found it in the trash.

 

4 Q. That’s the sketch of Elvis?

 

5 A. Yes.

 

6 Q. You complained at Neverland that you should

 

7 be paid more, right?

 

8 A. I don’t believe I did.

 

9 Q. Never said that to anybody?

 

10 A. I don’t recall saying that.

 

11 Q. Okay. And you say you left voluntarily,

 

12 correct?

 

13 A. I left after the harassment and the death

 

14 threats, yes.

 

15 Q. And then you filed a claim for disability

 

16 with EDD, right?

 

17 A. No.

 

18 MR. ZONEN: Objection; asked and answered.

 

19 THE COURT: Sustained.

 

20 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Ralph Chacon stopped

 

21 working at Neverland the same day you stopped,

 

22 right?

 

23 A. I don’t believe so.

 

24 Q. Kassim Abdool stopped working there the same

 

25 day you stopped, didn’t he?

 

26 A. I don’t believe so.

 

27 Q. All — excuse me.

Jackson wasn’t the only person that she sued after leaving Neverland! Several other employees of Jackson were sued, including Bill Bray, one of Jackson’s closest bodyguards, and another employee named Jerome Johnson, who subsequently joined the Neverland Five lawsuit against Jackson, until he and his wife were found to have sent an extortion letter to Jackson demanding $3 million dollars! (Read this post for more information out Jerome Johnson’s attempted extortion of Jackson.)

28 Now, you sued someone named Bill Bray, 5410

 

1 correct?

 

2 A. Yes.

 

3 Q. And who is Bill Bray?

 

4 A. He was the — how would you say it? Maybe

 

5 the top man for the Office of Special Services.

 

6 Q. You sued Betty Bailey, right?

 

7 A. Yes.

 

8 Q. And who was Betty Bailey?

 

9 A. She was maybe like his right hand.

 

10 Q. And you sued Mr. Jackson’s personal security

 

11 people, right?

 

12 A. Yes, I did.

 

13 Q. You sued Jimmy Van Norman, right?

 

14 A. Yes, I did.

 

15 Q. Marcus Johnson, right?

 

16 A. Yes. Yes.

 

17 Q. Tony Coleman?

 

18 A. Yes.

 

19 Q. And Jerome J.J. Johnson, right?

 

20 A. Yes.

 

21 Q. And at some point you approached Mr. Johnson

 

22 about testifying for you, right?

 

23 A. No, I did not.

 

24 Q. Someone on your behalf did, right?

 

25 A. All I know is that I believe that, from what

 

26 I understand, he jumped onto our side and decided to

 

27 tell the truth about what was going on.

 

28 Q. And when you say he “decided to tell the 5411

 

1 truth,” you dropped your suit against him, right?

 

2 A. I believe we did.

 

3 Q. And the jury didn’t believe him either,

 

4 right?

 

5 MR. ZONEN: Objection.

 

6 THE COURT: Sustained.

 

7 MR. ZONEN: He never testified. Assumes

 

8 facts not in evidence that he testified.

 

9 THE COURT: I sustained your objection.

 

10 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Do you remember when Mr.

 

11 Johnson got in trouble for sending an extortion

 

12 letter to Mr. Jackson asking for three million

 

13 dollars?

 

14 A. I did learn of that through the later part

 

15 of my deposition, which I knew nothing about.

 

16 Q. At the point where you learned about Mr.

 

17 Johnson’s $3 million extortion letter to Mr.

 

18 Jackson, were you working with him on your lawsuit?

 

19 A. No.

 

20 Q. You stole commemorative Pepsi cans from

 

21 Neverland, did you not?

 

22 A. No, I did not.

 

23 Q. You were accused of that, right?

 

24 A. No, I was not.

 

25 Q. Do you know someone name Peter Burt?

 

26 A. No, I do not.

 

27 Q. Never heard the name?

 

28 A. I’ve heard of the name, but I do not know 5412

 

1 him.

 

2 Q. Okay. You do know Sandie Domz, do you not?

 

3 A. Yes, I do.

 

4 Q. Who is Sandie Domz?

 

5 A. She was an office administrator, a secretary

 

6 for Neverland Valley Ranch.

 

7 Q. You and the other plaintiffs in that lawsuit

 

8 decided that she would go to the show Hard Copy to

 

9 try and sell a story, correct?

 

10 A. Not that I ever recall.

 

11 Q. Are you saying that didn’t happen, or you

 

12 just don’t remember?

 

13 A. That did not happen.

 

14 Q. So you never got together and said, “We’ll

 

15 split money that we could get from Hard Copy”?

 

16 A. No, I did not.

 

17 MR. SANGER: Inside Edition.

 

18 (Off-the-record discussion held at counsel

 

19 table.)

Well, we now know how Victor Gutierrez was able to get some of the information that he used in his book “Michael Jackson Was My Lover”! And that’s because McManus admitted in this excerpt that she met with him and gave him information about Jackson. The fact that she was one of his sources should tell you all you need to know about the quality of the “research” in his book!

20 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: How much in total did Mr.

 

21 Ring collect on your behalf from tabloids or media?

 

22 A. From what I recall from my deposition, which

 

23 there were stubs in my deposition, that showed, I’m

 

24 thinking, maybe 32,000.

 

25 Q. Okay. Did any of that go to you?

 

26 A. 1,000.

 

27 Q. Now, you spent days being interviewed by a

 

28 book author named Mr. Gutierrez, right? 5413

 

1 A. Days being interviewed?

 

2 Q. Yes.

 

3 A. No.

 

4 Q. Were you interviewed by a book author named

 

5 Mr. Gutierrez?

 

6 A. I never was interviewed, but I did meet with

 

7 him.

 

8 Q. And approximately when did you meet with

 

9 him?

 

10 A. You know, I cannot recall the date.

 

11 Q. Well, you certainly had a discussion with

 

12 him about the fact that he was writing a book,

 

13 didn’t you?

 

14 A. No, I did not.

 

15 Q. So when you met with him, you didn’t know he

 

16 was writing a book?

 

17 A. No, when I met with him, he was going to try

 

18 to help us in our lawsuit.

 

19 Q. Did you ever learn he was writing a book

 

20 about Mr. Jackson?

 

21 A. I never — I don’t recall him saying that he

 

22 was writing a book. I don’t remember that.

 

23 Q. Did you give him information about Mr.

 

24 Jackson?

 

25 A. Um, later I did.

McManus was then forced to admit to the jury that she was dishonest during her direct testimony when she was impeached with her deposition transcript from 1993. In this excerpt, you’ll see her admit that she didn’t tell police about any alleged misconduct by Jackson during her first interview with them, she always saw Wade Robeson with his parents at Neverland, Brett Barnes’ mother would give her his clothes for her to wash, and that she insinuated that Jackson and June Chandler were having a romantic relationship by stating that she saw her in his bedroom, but excluding the fact that she was there to bring Jordan his clothes!

26 Q. When you first talked to the Santa Barbara

 

27 Sheriffs, you didn’t tell them about inappropriate

 

28 behavior you’d seen by Mr. Jackson, correct? 5414

 

1 A. Probably not.

 

2 Q. You waited to say that in your lawsuit,

 

3 correct?

 

4 A. I don’t recall.

 

5 Q. Going back to your deposition in the

 

6 Chandler suit – okay? —

 

7 A. Uh-huh.

 

8 Q. — you were asked if you’d ever seen Wade

 

9 Robeson at the ranch without one of his parents, and

 

10 you said, “No,” right?

 

11 A. I don’t — I have not gone over that, so I

 

12 do not recall what I’ve said or —

 

13 Q. Would it refresh your recollection to just

 

14 take a look at the page?

 

15 A. Yeah.

 

16 MR. MESEREAU: May I approach, Your Honor?

 

17 THE COURT: Yes.

 

18 THE WITNESS: Okay.

 

19 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Have you had a chance to

 

20 look at that page?

 

21 A. Yes.

 

22 Q. Does it refresh your recollection about what

 

23 you said under oath in that deposition?

 

24 A. Yes.

 

25 Q. And on that issue, what did you say?

 

26 A. “No.”

 

27 Q. You said you had never seen Wade Robeson at

 

28 the ranch without one of his parents, right? 5415

1 A. Correct.

 

2 Q. You were asked if you had ever seen Brett

 

3 Barnes’ clothes in Mr. Jackson’s bedroom, right?

 

4 A. If it’s there. Like I said, I have not gone

 

5 over that.

 

6 Q. And your response was sometimes his mother

 

7 would give you his clothes to wash, right?

 

8 A. Yeah, probably.

 

9 Q. Is that what you remember saying?

 

10 A. Like I said, I have not gone over that in

 

11 probably ten years.

 

12 Q. Would it refresh your recollection to just

 

13 take a look at that page?

 

14 A. Sure.

 

15 MR. MESEREAU: May I approach, Your Honor?

 

16 THE COURT: Yes.

 

17 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Have you had a chance to

 

18 look at that page?

 

19 A. Yes, I did.

 

20 Q. Does it refresh your recollection about what

 

21 you said?

 

22 A. Yes.

 

23 Q. And you said that his mother would give you

 

24 his clothes, correct?

 

25 A. Correct.

 

26 Q. You didn’t see his clothes in Mr. Jackson’s

 

27 bedroom, right?

 

28 A. Um – 5416

 

1 Q. Excuse me, at that point in time, you said

 

2 you didn’t see his clothes in Mr. Jackson’s bedroom,

 

3 his mother would give you his clothes, correct?

 

4 A. Correct.

 

5 Q. You also said you’d never seen any of the

 

6 Culkin boys’ clothes in Mr. Jackson’s bedroom,

 

7 right?

 

8 A. If it’s there, that’s probably what I said

 

9 at that time.

 

10 Q. Let me just go back a little bit. You said

 

11 that you saw Macaulay Culkin and his brother at

 

12 Neverland, right?

 

13 A. I probably did.

 

14 Q. Would it refresh your recollection to look

 

15 at that page?

 

16 A. Sure.

 

17 MR. MESEREAU: Okay. May I approach?

 

18 THE COURT: Yes.

 

19 THE WITNESS: Okay. Okay.

 

20 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Have you had a chance to

 

21 look at that page?

 

22 A. Yes, I did.

 

23 Q. Does it refresh your recollection about what

 

24 you said on that topic?

 

25 A. Yes.

 

26 Q. You said that you had never seen the Culkin

 

27 boys’ clothes in Mr. Jackson’s bedroom, right?

 

28 A. Yes. 5417

 

1 Q. You also told Mr. Feldman that you had never

 

2 come to Mr. Jackson’s room in the morning and seen

 

3 anything that indicated somebody may have slept on

 

4 his floor, right?

 

5 A. I don’t recall. Sorry.

 

6 Q. Would it refresh your recollection to look

 

7 at that page?

 

8 A. Sure.

 

9 MR. MESEREAU: May I, Your Honor?

 

10 THE COURT: Yes.

 

11 THE WITNESS: Okay.

 

12 MR. MESEREAU: Thank you.

 

13 THE WITNESS: Uh-huh.

 

14 MR. MESEREAU: Have you had a chance to look

 

15 at that?

 

16 A. Yes.

 

17 Q. Does that refresh your recollection about

 

18 what you said?

 

19 A. Yes.

 

20 Q. And what did you say?

 

21 A. “No.”

 

22 Q. Do you remember testifying that Mr. Jackson

 

23 had never given you money?

 

24 A. I don’t recall that. I don’t —

 

25 Q. Did Mr. Jackson give you money from time to

 

26 time?

 

27 A. No. There was just one time.

 

28 Q. Okay. And that was when you told the jury 5418

 

1 that you got 300 bucks to lie in a deposition?

 

2 A. That —

 

3 MR. ZONEN: Objection; misstates the

 

4 testimony of the witness.

 

5 MR. MESEREAU: Let me rephrase that.

 

6 Q. Did you tell the jury that Mr. Jackson gave

 

7 you $300 to lie in a deposition?

 

8 MR. ZONEN: Objection; misstatement of

 

9 evidence.

 

10 THE COURT: Overruled.

 

11 You may answer.

 

12 THE WITNESS: What I said was the $300 was

 

13 given to me after Mr. Jackson had read the

 

14 transcripts of Jordie Chandler.

 

15 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Okay. And you interpreted

 

16 that as a token of his appreciation?

 

17 A. Yes, for covering up for him.

 

18 Q. Okay. 300 bucks?

 

19 A. Yes.

 

20 Q. Okay. Do you remember being asked if you’d

 

21 ever seen a woman in Mr. Jackson’s bedroom?

 

22 A. I can’t recall that.

 

23 Q. You said you had seen June Chandler in his

 

24 bedroom, right?

 

25 A. I believe to bring in Jordie’s clothes.

 

26 Q. Well, let me just go step by step. You

 

27 testified under oath in the deposition that you had

 

28 seen June Chandler in Mr. Jackson’s bedroom, right? 5419

 

1 A. To bring in his clothes, yes.

 

2 Q. You said you had never seen Mr. Jackson and

 

3 June Chandler in any romantic relationship, right?

 

4 A. Correct.

 

5 Q. You weren’t aware of her sleeping with Mr.

 

6 Jackson, right?

 

7 A. No.

 

8 Q. But you saw her in his room?

 

9 A. To bring in the clothes, yes.

 

10 Q. Well, you didn’t say “to bring in the

 

11 clothes” in the deposition, right?

 

12 A. I don’t know what’s in the deposition.

 

13 Q. Would it refresh your recollection to look

 

14 at that page?

 

15 A. Sure.

 

16 MR. ZONEN: I’ll object as irrelevant and

 

17 hearsay.

 

18 MR. MESEREAU: I think the prosecution

 

19 raised the issue of what was happening in that

 

20 bedroom.

 

21 THE COURT: I’ll allow you to refresh her

 

22 recollection.

 

23 MR. MESEREAU: May I approach, Your Honor?

 

24 THE COURT: Yes.

 

25 THE WITNESS: Okay.

 

26 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Have you had a chance to

 

27 look at that page of your deposition?

 

28 A. Yes, I did. 5420

 

1 Q. Does it refresh your recollection about what

 

2 you said about June Chandler being in Mr. Jackson’s

 

3 room?

 

4 A. Yes.

 

5 Q. You said you had seen June Chandler in his

 

6 room, right?

 

7 A. Yes.

 

8 Q. You didn’t explain it in terms of her coming

 

9 there for clothes, or with clothes, right?

 

10 A. I guess not, no.

 

11 Q. You testified that you had seen Jordie

 

12 Chandler and Michael Jackson together outside on a

 

13 Jet Ski in the water, right?

 

14 A. I probably did.

 

15 Q. Do you remember that?

 

16 A. Slightly.

 

17 Q. You indicated you had seen Mr. Jackson in

 

18 water balloon fights and squirt gun fights, right?

 

19 A. I believe so.

 

20 Q. And you saw that once in a while, didn’t

 

21 you, while you worked there?

 

22 A. Yes.

 

23 Q. He would do that with kids all the time,

 

24 wouldn’t he?

 

25 A. Yeah, sometimes.

 

26 Q. Was it your impression that Mr. Jackson

 

27 liked water balloon fights?

 

28 MR. ZONEN: I’ll object as speculative. 5421

 

1 THE COURT: Sustained.

 

2 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: You said you had never

 

3 seen Mr. Jackson hold hands with anyone at the

 

4 ranch, right?

5 A. I don’t recall that.

 

6 Q. Could I refresh your recollection —

 

7 A. Sure.

 

8 Q. — by showing you the page?

 

9 A. Sure.

 

10 MR. MESEREAU: May I, Your Honor?

 

11 THE COURT: Yes.

 

12 THE WITNESS: Okay.

 

13 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Have you had a chance to

 

14 look at that page?

 

15 A. Yes, I did.

 

16 Q. Does it refresh your recollection about what

 

17 you said?

 

18 A. Yes.

 

19 Q. You said you’d never seen Michael Jackson

 

20 hold hands with anybody at the ranch, right?

 

21 A. Correct.

Here is more about how McManus and her cohorts attempted to (and eventually did) sell stories about Jackson and Lisa Marie Presley to numerous tabloids and TV shows, including Inside Edition, as well as many other stories about Jackson:

22 Q. Okay. Now, there was approximately a

 

23 one-year period between this deposition and the

 

24 actual filing of your lawsuit against Mr. Jackson,

 

25 right?

 

26 A. Are you talking about Jordie Chandler?

 

27 Q. Well, approximately a one-year period

 

28 between your deposition in the Chandler case and the 5422

 

1 filing of your lawsuit, correct?

 

2 A. I believe so.

 

3 Q. Now, the Chandler deposition was in

 

4 December, and the next December you filed your

 

5 lawsuit, right?

 

6 A. I know the Chandler one was probably

 

7 December 7th of — oh, gosh, I don’t know if it was

 

8 ‘93 or ‘94. I don’t — I’m not — I don’t know the

 

9 dates.

 

10 Q. Okay. We talked about a little earlier that

 

11 December 7th, 1993, is the deposition in the

 

12 Chandler case.

 

13 A. Okay.

 

14 Q. And your lawsuit is December 2nd, 1994?

 

15 A. Okay.

 

16 Q. Okay?

 

17 A. Yes.

 

18 Q. Now, how long after the Feldman deposition

 

19 in the Chandler case did you to go a lawyer to talk

 

20 about suing?

 

21 A. I don’t know how long after it was. I

 

22 just — I know I left Neverland in the end of July

 

23 of ‘94. It might have been — I don’t even want to

 

24 guess because I’m not real — I’m not sure.

 

25 Q. You must have had a lot of meetings with Mr.

 

26 Ring before you actually finalized the lawsuit,

 

27 right?

 

28 A. I believe so. 5423

 

1 Q. And do you know roughly when that started?

 

2 A. You know, in my head, I don’t know why I

 

3 keep thinking 1995, but I don’t know.

 

4 Q. For how many months do you think you and

 

5 Ralph Chacon and Kassim Abdool met with Mr. Ring

 

6 before the action was filed?

 

7 A. I really can’t answer that, because I really

 

8 don’t know.

 

9 Q. Approximately when did you stop working at

 

10 Neverland?

 

11 A. The exact date — my last day, I believe,

 

12 was July the 31st of ‘94.

 

13 Q. Do you recall participating in an Inside

 

14 Edition show?

 

15 A. I believe so.

 

16 Q. And when did you participate in a show about

 

17 Mr. Jackson for Inside Edition?

 

18 A. I believe that had to do when we contacted

 

19 Gary Morgan. That was all around the same time, so

 

20 our lawsuit had already been going on.

 

21 Q. Do you remember meeting with representatives

 

22 of Inside Edition?

 

23 A. I remember — I remember those — the people

 

24 from Inside Edition showing up at our attorney’s

 

25 office, so I guess, yeah.

 

26 Q. Did you meet with them with your lawyer?

 

27 A. Yes.

 

28 Q. And was Ralph Chacon in that meeting? 5424

 

1 A. You know what, I really can’t recall.

 

2 Q. Was Kassim Abdool in that meeting?

 

3 A. I don’t want to say yes, because I can’t

 

4 recall.

 

5 Q. But the subject was Mr. Jackson, right?

 

6 A. Yes, it was.

 

7 Q. Do you remember trying to sell information

 

8 about Mr. Jackson’s relationship with Ms. Presley?

 

9 A. There could have been something of that.

 

10 Possibly, yes.

 

11 Q. You say, “Possibly, yes”?

 

12 A. Yeah.

 

13 Q. Well, I mean, you were actually trying to

 

14 get money from tabloids in return for your giving

 

15 them personal information about Mr. Jackson’s

 

16 relationship with Miss Presley, right?

 

17 A. We were trying to get money to help with our

 

18 lawsuit to fight Mr. Jackson.

 

19 Q. Do you recall ever going to anyone in the

 

20 media and telling them you had inside information on

 

21 Mr. Jackson’s relationship with Miss Presley?

 

22 A. I don’t recall that.

 

23 Q. Okay. Do you recall ever giving information

 

24 to anyone in the media involving Miss Presley and

 

25 Mr. Jackson?

 

26 A. I believe we probably did with Gary Morgan.

 

27 Q. And he was your media broker, wasn’t he?

 

28 A. I believe so. 5425

 

1 Q. He was the one that you were using and Ralph

 

2 Chacon was using to find media outlets to sell

 

3 information to, right?

 

4 A. I believe so.

 

5 Q. Okay. And you met him through Attorney

 

6 Ring; is that correct?

 

7 A. Yes.

 

8 Q. Okay. Did you ever see any tabloids that

 

9 quoted you about Mr. Jackson?

 

10 A. I — I could have.

 

11 Q. You’re not sure?

 

12 A. I’m not real, real sure.

 

13 Q. Did you ever see any tabloids that quoted

 

14 you about Mr. Jackson’s relationship with Miss

 

15 Presley?

 

16 A. I could have. It’s been a long time. I

 

17 kind of can’t remember.

 

18 Q. Do you remember Star magazine asking you to

 

19 sign a contract whereby you would give them

 

20 information about Mr. Jackson and his relationship

 

21 with his wife, Lisa Marie Presley?

 

22 A. I remember something to do with Gary Morgan

 

23 and something with Star, but I don’t remember

 

24 everything that was discussed with that.

 

25 Q. Might it refresh your recollection if I just

 

26 show you that document?

 

27 A. Sure.

 

28 MR. MESEREAU: May I, Your Honor? 5426

 

1 THE COURT: Yes.

 

2 THE WITNESS: Okay.

 

3 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Have you had a chance to

 

4 look at that document?

 

5 A. Yes.

 

6 Q. Does it appear to be a contract with Star

 

7 magazine?

 

8 A. Yes.

 

9 Q. And you signed that, correct?

 

10 A. Yes.

 

11 Q. Okay. And among other things, you agreed to

 

12 provide information about Mr. Jackson’s relationship

 

13 with Lisa Marie Presley, right?

 

14 A. I believe so.

 

15 Q. And Ralph Chacon signed that, did he not?

 

16 A. I believe so.

 

17 Q. Now, you’ve heard the name Splash, correct?

 

18 A. Correct.

 

19 Q. And who was Splash?

 

20 A. I really — all I know about Splash is that

 

21 it was linked up with Gary Morgan, so I don’t know a

 

22 lot of this tabloid stuff. I don’t know.

 

23 Q. Well, Splash was an agency, was it not, that

 

24 was retained by you to find media sources, right?

 

25 A. If it was retained, it would have been with

 

26 Michael Ring, my attorney.

 

27 Q. Okay. You signed an agreement with Splash

 

28 News and Picture Agency, right? 5427

 

1 A. I believe so.

 

2 Q. And was your involvement with Splash always

 

3 through Mr. Ring?

 

4 A. Yes.

 

5 Q. Did you ever deal with Splash directly?

 

6 A. No, I did not.

 

7 Q. How long were you working with Splash?

 

8 A. I have no idea. I don’t know the dates.

9 Q. At some point — at some point did your

 

10 relationship with Splash end?

 

11 A. I’m sure it did.

 

12 Q. Okay. Do you know approximately when?

 

13 A. No, I do not.

 

14 Q. Were you giving information to any tabloids

 

15 or media sources during your trial?

 

16 A. Only through Splash.

 

17 Q. And that went on during the trial, right?

 

18 A. Probably sometime during the trial, yes.

 

19 Q. Do you recall trying to sell what you called

 

20 “Mr. Jackson’s sex secrets”? Do you remember that?

 

21 A. I know something was written about that, but

 

22 I know sometimes tabloids write other stuff that

 

23 they like to put in, so I don’t know.

 

24 Q. You were quoted in an issue of Star magazine

 

25 titled “Five of His Closest Servants Tell All.

 

26 Kinky Sex Secrets of Michael and Lisa Marie’s

 

27 Bedroom,” right?

 

28 A. I don’t believe I said that. 5428

 

1 Q. Have you seen that article before?

 

2 A. I did during my deposition.

 

3 Q. Was that the first time you’d ever seen this

 

4 article?

 

5 A. Yes.

 

6 Q. You are quoted in the article, correct?

 

7 A. I don’t know. I could be. I don’t know.

 

8 Q. Would it refresh your recollection if I just

 

9 show you —

 

10 A. Sure, you can.

 

11 MR. MESEREAU: May I, Your Honor?

 

12 THE COURT: Yes.

 

13 THE WITNESS: Kind of hard to see that.

 

14 Okay.

 

15 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Have you had a chance to

 

16 look at that article?

 

17 A. Yes.

 

18 Q. Does it refresh your recollection about you

 

19 being quoted in that article?

 

20 A. Yes.

 

21 Q. You were going to tabloids and saying that

 

22 you were the only person with a key to Mr. Jackson’s

 

23 bedroom and you had information to sell, right?

 

24 A. Um, as I’ve said, I know we did interview —

 

25 the interview with Gary Morgan. But a lot of the

 

26 times with those tabloids, those tabloids write

 

27 other stuff and put it in there, and it makes it

 

28 look like I said it, when I didn’t say it. So I 5429

 

1 don’t know how to answer that.

 

2 Q. Well, did he have authorization from you to

 

3 quote you with various tabloids?

 

4 A. You know what, that’s where I don’t know.

 

5 He was dealing with Michael Ring, so I really don’t

 

6 know. I kind of got stuck in the middle.

 

7 Q. Well, at some point you must have known that

 

8 your quotes were appearing in tabloids regarding Mr.

 

9 Jackson, true?

 

10 MR. ZONEN: Assumes facts not in evidence

 

11 that there were quotes.

 

12 THE COURT: Sustained.

 

13 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: During the time you were

 

14 represented by Attorney Ring, did you learn from

 

15 time to time that your name and various quotes about

 

16 Mr. Jackson were appearing in the media?

 

17 A. Just through the Gary Morgan deal. That’s

 

18 all I recall.

 

19 Q. What I’m trying to find out is this: Did

 

20 you sort of leave it to other people to sort of

 

21 quote you when they wanted in the media?

 

22 A. Actually, sometimes you have no control over

 

23 what people quote you in the media.

 

24 Q. But you’re not saying you had nothing to do

 

25 with these quotes, are you?

 

26 A. I can’t answer that, because I don’t know

 

27 what was quoted.

 

28 Q. Okay. You never learned? 5430

 

1 A. No. Huh-uh.

Victor Gutierrez just couldn’t keep his nose out of Jackson’s business, as he was able to weasel his way into the trial and speak with McManus and the other plaintiffs during their civil trial.

2 Q. During your trial with Mr. Jackson, were you

 

3 speaking to various newscasters?

 

4 A. Only Gary Morgan is all that I recall, and

 

5 when we met with Victor Gutierrez, and that was it.

 

6 Q. Would he arrange meetings for you?

 

7 A. Victor Gutierrez?

 

8 Q. No, Mr. Morgan.

 

9 A. I believe he might have, through Mr. Ring.

 

10 Q. Was it — let me rephrase that.

 

11 Was it typical during your relationship with

 

12 Mr. Morgan that he would fax a story to you to have

 

13 you review it, and ask you to see if you wanted any

 

14 changes, and then you would fax it back?

 

15 A. What I recall is viewing one — I don’t know

 

16 what you call it, I don’t know if it was a

 

17 transcript, and that’s the only thing I remember

 

18 seeing.

 

19 Q. Did the group used to meet with Mr. Morgan?

 

20 A. The only time we all met was with Mr. Ring

 

21 at his office.

 

22 Q. And you had a number of meetings with Mr.

 

23 Ring, Mr. Morgan, and the group that was suing

 

24 Michael Jackson, true?

 

25 A. Maybe two meetings that I can recall.

 

26 Q. And Ralph Chacon was at those meetings,

 

27 right?

 

28 A. He might have been at one. I don’t know if 5431

 

1 he was at all of them.

 

2 Q. When did you last talk to Ralph Chacon?

 

3 A. It’s been a while. I don’t know, maybe — I

 

4 really can’t — it’s been a while.

 

5 Q. When did you last talk to Kassim Abdool?

 

6 A. Actually, the last time I spoke with Kassim

 

7 was during our verdict, when we lost, and I have not

 

8 seen him since.

 

9 Q. How about Melanie Bagnall?

 

10 A. I see her off and on.

 

11 Q. Do you recall your being quoted in any

 

12 Australian newspapers about Mr. Jackson’s private

 

13 life?

 

14 A. No.

 

15 Q. Was it your understanding that Mr. Morgan

 

16 was going to try and use your quotes in foreign

 

17 newspapers about Mr. Jackson?

 

18 A. I have no idea.

 

19 Q. How many television shows do you think you

 

20 appeared on where you purported to give private

 

21 information about Michael Jackson?

 

22 A. The only thing that I can recall that I

 

23 appeared on was maybe with Inside — I think it was

 

24 Inside Edition. There wasn’t an interview with me,

 

25 but I think they captured me walking, maybe, with —

 

26 I don’t know if it was Kassim.

 

27 Q. Do you recall meeting with any

 

28 representative of the media while you worked at 5432

 

1 Neverland?

 

2 A. No.

 

3 Q. And you’re telling the jury that you never

 

4 had any discussion with any employee while you

 

5 worked at Neverland about what you could make by

 

6 selling a story?

 

7 A. The only thing I recall when I worked at

 

8 Neverland was one of the maids, Francine Orosco, had

 

9 contacted the media. I don’t know if it was — it

 

10 was one of the tabloids and they had offered her

 

11 $2,000, and she was going to come out and talk, but

 

12 they wanted her picture. And she was considering

 

13 doing that. That’s the only thing I ever remember

 

14 with that.

 

15 Q. Finally, when did you last talk to anyone

 

16 representing any media outlet about Mr. Jackson?

 

17 A. I have not interviewed with anybody about

 

18 Mr. Jackson.

 

19 Q. I don’t mean an interview. I mean when have

 

20 you last spoken with anyone who purported to

 

21 represent the media?

 

22 A. I haven’t really been talking to anybody

 

23 about anything in the — with the media.

 

24 Q. Has anyone called you from the media?

 

25 A. I did get a call from somebody from London

 

26 at my job, and they wanted to interview, and I told

 

27 them no.

 

28 Q. When was that? 5433

 

1 A. Maybe about — within the last week.

 

2 Q. And you didn’t interview because there is a

 

3 court order in this case that you’re not allowed to

 

4 do that if you’re a witness, right?

 

5 A. That’s correct.

 

6 Q. Did you agree with them that on a future

 

7 date you may speak to them?

 

8 A. I told them that I was not interested in

 

9 doing any interviews, that I was under a gag order.

 

10 MR. MESEREAU: No further questions at this

 

11 time.

12 THE COURT: Redirect?

Under redirect examination, Zonen questioned McManus about the quotes that she gave to the tabloids about the “kinky sex life” of Jackson and Lisa Marie, and she admitted that they were false statements.

14 REDIRECT EXAMINATION

 

15 BY MR. ZONEN:

 

16 Q. Mr. Mesereau asked you some questions about

 

17 an article that was in a tabloid that quotes you as

 

18 saying that you have all kinds of information about

 

19 kinky sex secrets between Michael Jackson and Lisa

 

20 Marie Presley. He showed you that article and asked

 

21 you if it refreshed your recollection as to whether

 

22 there was, in fact, such an article, and you said

 

23 yes, it refreshed your recollection as to that

 

24 article.

 

25 About the quotations in the article, are

 

26 they accurate?

 

27 A. No, they are not.

 

28 Q. Did you ever give information about kinky 5434

 

1 sex secrets between Michael Jackson and Lisa Marie

 

2 Presley to any publication, any media, or any

 

3 reporter?

 

4 A. No, never.

 

5 Q. Do you, in fact, have information of kinky

 

6 sex secrets between Michael Jackson and Lisa Marie

 

7 Presley?

 

8 A. No, I do not.

 

9 Q. Have you ever seen Michael Jackson with Lisa

 

10 Marie Presley?

 

11 A. How do you mean, “seen”?

 

12 Q. Was she at the ranch during the period of

 

13 time that you were there?

 

14 A. Yes, she was.

 

15 Q. Were they married during that time?

 

16 A. No.

 

17 Q. Were they visiting one another?

 

18 A. I believe so.

 

19 Q. Do you have any information at all that Lisa

 

20 Marie Presley ever stayed with Michael Jackson in

 

21 his room?

 

22 A. No.

 

23 Q. Did you ever see any woman stay with Michael

 

24 Jackson in his room in the four years you worked for

 

25 him?

 

26 A. No, I did not.

 

Next, McManus contradicted her deposition testimony and stated that she did indeed see Jackson holding hands with someone at Neverland, and that person was Brett Barnes, and that she saw evidence of young boys sleeping in Jackson’s bedroom. This was an obvious attempt to paint Jackson as a pervert who had an attraction to young boys:

27 Q. You stated in the deposition that you had

 

28 never seen Michael Jackson hold hands with anyone. 5435

 

1 Is that a correct statement?

 

2 A. No.

 

3 Q. Have you seen him holding hands with people?

 

4 A. Yes.

 

5 Q. Who?

 

6 A. Brett Barnes. The children that were at the

 

7 ranch.

 

8 Q. You told Mr. Feldman during the deposition

 

9 that you had never come into Mr. Jackson’s room and

 

10 seen evidence that somebody had slept on the floor.

 

11 Was that, in fact, a correct statement?

 

12 A. That’s correct.

 

13 Q. In fact, during the time that you had worked

 

14 there, you had never seen any evidence that someone

 

15 had slept on the floor?

 

16 A. Correct.

 

17 Q. You told Mr. Mesereau about June Chandler

 

18 unpacking clothing in Mr. Jackson’s bedroom. Did

 

19 that, in fact, happen?

 

20 A. Yes, it did.

 

21 Q. Explain that to us, please.

 

22 A. June Chandler had gone into Mr. Jackson’s

 

23 room and brought in suitcases of Jordie Chandler’s

 

24 clothes, since he was staying with Mr. Jackson in

 

25 his bedroom.

 

26 Q. I guess that begs the question, Miss

 

27 Chandler obviously knew that her son was sleeping in

 

28 that room, correct? 5436

 

1 A. Yes.

 

2 MR. MESEREAU: Objection; calls for

 

3 speculation.

 

4 THE COURT: Argumentative; sustained.

 

5 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Did she do this on more than

 

6 one occasion?

 

7 A. I believe so.

 

8 Q. Was there a dresser or a drawer set up for

 

9 Jordie’s clothing?

 

10 A. No. The clothes would just get put anywhere

 

11 in the room.

 

12 Q. Were there any — was there any occasion

 

13 that you saw June Chandler in Michael Jackson’s room

 

14 when she was not attending to her child’s clothing?

 

15 A. Not that I can recall.

 

16 Q. You testified in the deposition that you had

 

17 not seen Wade Robeson on the property without a

 

18 parent. Was that a correct statement?

 

19 A. I’m sorry, you lost me.

 

20 Q. Had you ever seen Wade Robeson at Neverland

 

21 without a parent?

 

22 A. No.

 

23 Q. Who was the parent that was always there?

 

24 A. His mother.

 

25 Q. And you never met the father?

 

26 A. No.

 

27 Q. Your initial conversations with the

 

28 sheriff’s office, were they at a time that you were 5437

 

1 still employed at Neverland Ranch?

 

2 A. Yes.

 

3 Q. You testified in the deposition that Brett

 

4 Barnes’ mother would bring you his clothes to wash.

 

5 Was that, in fact, true?

 

6 A. At times that was true.

 

7 Q. Was that always the manner in which you

 

8 washed his clothes?

 

9 A. No.

 

10 Q. In what other ways would you be washing his

 

11 clothes?

 

12 A. If they were left in Mr. Jackson’s room, I

 

13 would take them and wash them along with Mr.

 

14 Jackson’s clothes.

Here are more of McManus’s outrageous claims of seeing Jackson in bed with boys:

15 Q. You have testified in the Chandler

 

16 deposition that you never saw Jordie and Michael

 

17 Jackson in his bedroom together. Was that a correct

 

18 statement?

 

19 A. No, it was not.

 

20 Q. Had you seen the two of them together in the

 

21 bedroom?

 

22 A. Yes.

 

23 Q. On more than one occasion?

 

24 A. Yes.

 

25 Q. Had you ever seen them in bed together?

 

26 A. Not in bed, no.

 

27 Q. You testified that you never saw Brett

 

28 Barnes sleep in the bedroom with Michael Jackson. 5438

 

1 You testified to that in the deposition, the

 

2 Chandler deposition. Was that a correct statement?

 

3 A. No, it was not.

 

4 Q. Had you, in fact, seen Brett Barnes sleep in

 

5 a bedroom with Michael Jackson?

 

6 A. He was staying with Mr. Jackson.

 

7 Q. Did you ever actually see either Michael

 

8 Jackson or Brett Barnes in bed in Michael Jackson’s

 

9 room?

 

10 A. One morning I might have seen them in bed,

 

11 yes.

 

12 Q. Do you have a recollection of that?

 

13 A. Yes.

 

14 Q. What did you see?

 

15 A. I brought breakfast and they were sitting in

 

16 the bed.

 

17 Q. Both of them together?

 

18 A. Yes.

 

19 Q. Do you recall how they were dressed?

 

20 A. I don’t recall.

 

21 Q. Were they in the bed, under the covers,

 

22 or —

 

23 A. Yes.

 

24 Q. They were in the bed under the covers?

 

25 A. Yes.

 

26 Q. You testified that you never saw Jordie

 

27 Chandler either get ready for bed or get up in the

 

28 morning. Were either of those statements true? 5439

 

1 A. Yes.

 

2 Q. Both of them?

 

3 A. Yes.

Here is some more pre-emptive karma! McManus testified that she had been bitten by Bubbles the Chimp; maybe Bubbles had a sixth sense in determining which Neverland employees would stab Jackson in the back, because he also bit Blanca Francia, not once but twice! (The second bite was probably because he knew that she would extort $2.4 million dollars from Jackson!)

4 Q. You testified that you never saw a chimp in

 

5 his bedroom. Was that statement true?

 

6 A. No.

 

7 Q. In fact, you’d been bitten by a chimp in his

 

8 bedroom; is that true?

 

9 A. Yes.

 

10 Q. Did you used to clean up after the monkeys?

 

11 A. Yes.

12 Q. Did you ever have to change their diapers?

 

13 MR. MESEREAU: Objection; leading.

 

14 THE COURT: Overruled.

 

15 You may answer.

 

16 THE WITNESS: Yes, I did.

 

17 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Did you ever have to clean up

 

18 monkey droppings on the floors?

 

19 A. Not on the floor. Just on the walls.

 

20 Q. On the walls?

 

21 A. Sometimes monkeys get wild.

 

22 Q. You actually have to clean up their —

 

23 A. Yes.

 

24 Q. — mess on the walls?

 

25 A. Yes.

Here is an excerpt from Blanca Francia’s testimony on April 5th, 2005 where she stated that she was also bit by Bubbles!

6 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: You remembered the monkey

7 Bubbles — excuse me, the chimp, the chimpanzee; is

8 that right?

9 A. Bubbles, yes.

10 Q. Was Bubbles at more than one location?

11 A. I don‟t remember that. I think I remember

12 that other little monkey. I think it was a

13 different one. But I remember Bubbles at

14 Havenhurst. And then he was taken to some kind of

15 farm or trainer.

16 Q. Did Bubbles get a little too big?

17 A. Yeah.

18 Q. Did Bubbles get rambunctious, wild?

19 A. Wild.

20 Q. Did Bubbles ever bite you?

21 A. Yeah.

22 Q. On more than one occasion?

23 A. Twice.

 

 

Zonen attempted to end his redirect examination on a high note by leading McManus into discrediting her own deposition by stating that she was uncomfortable with her son being around Jackson because – wait for this! – Jackson would rub his fingers through her son’s hair! Oh, the horror!

26 Q. You testified that you had never seen Jordie

 

27 and Michael Jackson in the Jacuzzi. Is that a

 

28 correct statement? 5440

 

1 A. Yes.

 

2 Q. You had testified yesterday that you had

 

3 testified in the Chandler lawsuit that you had no

 

4 problems leaving your son with Michael Jackson. Was

 

5 that true?

 

6 A. No.

 

7 Q. Were you, in fact, concerned about your son

 

8 and Michael Jackson?

 

9 A. Yes, I was.

 

10 Q. Did you ever see Michael Jackson with your

 

11 son behave in a way that concerned you?

 

12 A. Yes.

 

13 Q. What did he do?

 

14 A. Mr. Jackson would rub his fingers through my

 

15 son’s hair.

 

16 Q. Did that concern you at the time?

 

17 A. A little bit, yeah. I was a little upset.

 

18 MR. ZONEN: I have no further questions.

 

19 MR. MESEREAU: Very briefly.

Mesereau’s recross examination was very brief and to the point:

21 RECROSS-EXAMINATION

 

22 BY MR. MESEREAU:

 

23 Q. You tried to sell a story to a tabloid about

 

24 Mr. Jackson putting his fingers through your son’s

 

25 hair, didn’t you?

 

26 A. No, I did not.

 

27 Q. You tried to sell stories to tabloids about

 

28 your son’s experiences at Neverland, correct? 5441

 

1 A. No, I did not.

 

2 Q. Do you recall Mr. Jackson living at Lisa

 

3 Marie Presley’s home during the week, and Lisa Marie

 

4 Presley visiting on weekends during the time that

 

5 you worked at Neverland?

 

6 A. No.

 

7 Q. You saw her there?

 

8 A. Yes, I did.

 

9 Q. Okay. Did you ever see Brooke Shields there

 

10 before Lisa Marie Presley?

 

11 A. Yes, I — I saw Brooke Shields, but I don’t

 

12 know if it was before.

 

13 MR. MESEREAU: No further questions.

Zonen took one last opportunity to take a swipe at Jackson by asking McManus to state where Brooke Shields slept at during her times at Neverland:

15 FURTHER REDIRECT EXAMINATION

 

16 BY MR. ZONEN:

 

17 Q. Where did Brooke Shields stay when she

 

18 stayed at Neverland Ranch?

 

19 A. In a guest unit.

 

20 MR. ZONEN: No further questions.

 

21 MR. MESEREAU: No further questions.

 

22 THE COURT: All right. Thank you. You may

 

23 step down.

 

24 THE WITNESS: Thank you.

Summary of the Testimony of Adrian McManus

1. Adrian McManus was a former employee of Neverland, and her duties included cleaning and maintaining Jackson’s bedroom. She worked at Neverland from 1990 through 1994.

2. She claimed to have seen three instances of abuse by Jackson against Brett Barnes, Macaulay Culkin, and Jordan Chandler. In each instance, Jackson passionately caressed his “victims”, kissed them on the mouth, and fondled their genitals. Instead of immediately intervening to bring these alleged sexual assaults to an end, McManus simply “walked off” into another room! Unbelievable!

3. In an amazing and spectacular act of honesty, McManus denied ever seeing Jackson molest Wade Robeson! When you consider how easy it would have been to just include him with the other “victims” as a way to make her allegations more salacious, it’s very surprising that she chose to exude at least some honesty and integrity in this proceeding.

4. McManus didn’t intervene in any of the alleged instances of abuse that she claimed to have witness, and didn’t tell anyone until she hired her attorney Michael Ring to represent her and the four other Neverland employees in their frivolous “wrongful termination” lawsuit.

When questioned about the authenticity of her testimony during her deposition, McManus stated that she lied and denied seeing the abuse because Jackson had “threatened” her by saying “You know, Adrian, if you ever say or you do something that I don’t like, all I have to do is tell Bill Bray or Norma Stakos, and they will take care of you, but it wouldn’t come from me.” Whatever. McManus testified that she stayed at Neverland, despite this threat from Jackson, because her husband had been laid off, and she needed the $7.50 dollars an hour that she was earning.  

5. After the Chandler allegations broke out, Jackson’s chief of security Bill Bray hired a new group of security guards called “OSS”, and they allegedly intimidated and harassed several Neverland employees who had cooperated in the police investigation. McManus claimed that she had been sexually harassed, and received death threats to her home via telephone, and this prompted her to quit and file a wrongful termination and sexual harassment lawsuit against Jackson.

6. McManus described her motivation for suing Jackson, and the counterclaim that Jackson filed against her. She was accused by Jackson of stealing an expensive drawing, but she claimed that she found it in a trash can in the recreational room. McManus did not file for bankruptcy, unlike the other four Neverland employees, so to this day she still owes her portion of the $1.6 million dollar judgment against her! (To Jackson’s credit, he had a lien put on her paycheck during her tenure at Sears.)

 

7. McManus and the other Neverland employees granted an interview with Gary Morgan of the Splash tabloid, and they were paid very handsomely for it. The money was used to help finance their lawsuit against Jackson. Their attorney Michael Ring was paid $32,000 dollars, and McManus received only $1,000 dollars.

8. McManus was questioned again about the drawing that she admitted to taking from Neverland, which she subsequently sold to the Splash tabloid for $1,000 dollars. She claimed that she found Jackson’s drawing in the trash can, and sold it to Splash at the request of her attorney Michael Ring.

9. Zonen displayed a Xeroxed copy of $300 dollars in cash that McManus claimed that Jackson paid her in 1994 after her deposition in the Jordan Chandler investigation. She attempted to testify that Jackson called her at her home and asked her to bring him a transcript of her deposition, but Mesereau’s objection was sustained. It was allegedly Jackson’s way of “thanking” McManus for not telling the truth about what she saw in her deposition.

10. Under cross examination, McManus was grilled about the real reason why she lost the civil case involving herself and her husband; they were guardian ad litems for her brother’s estate, and were found to have willfully and maliciously  stolen the funds in a trust account that was meant for their niece and nephew! They were ordered to repay $30,584.89 plus the attorney’s fees of the plaintiffs, which totaled $5,085.27!

11. Mesereau then attacked her credibility even more by questioning her about the $35,000 dollar judgment that was entered against her for the sketch of Elvis Presley that she believed was drawn by Jackson, the fact that she stipulated that she had acted with fraud, oppression, and malice in her lawsuit against Jackson, and the punitive damages that would have been awarded to Jackson had he not waived the court hearing to decide the amount in exchange for one dollar! (How nice of him! But I guarantee it wasn’t just out of the kindness of their heart; it was because he knew it was pointless because they couldn’t pay it!)

12. When Mesereau questioned McManus about statements she made during her deposition in the Jordan Chandler investigation on December 7th, 1993, she testified that during that deposition (which was many months before her so-called “harassment” at Neverland began), she stated that she trusted Jackson and would leave her son around him, she never saw Jordan Chandler or Brett Barnes sleep in Jackson’s room, the reason Jordan Chandler’s clothes were in Jackson’s bedroom is because June Chandler brought them into his room in a suitcase, she “couldn’t tell” if Jordan Chandler ever took a shower with Jackson, she had never seen Jackson in a Jacuzzi, and that Jackson’s bedroom alarms were justified for security reasons!

She also admitted that she lied throughout her testimony, but “didn’t really think of it that way”. In reality, she told the truth throughout her deposition with Larry Feldman, and then subsequently lied and said she was lying throughout that testimony in order to maintain credibility with the prosecution.

13. McManus wasn’t “familiar” with the total amount of money she wanted from Jackson, and she even stated that a simple apology from Jackson would have sufficed! 

14. McManus admitted that she met with Victor Gutierrez and gave him information about Jackson. The fact that she was one of his sources should tell you all you need to know about the quality of the “research” in his book.

15. Under redirect examination, Zonen questioned McManus about the quotes that she gave to the tabloids about the “kinky sex life” of Jackson and Lisa Marie, and she admitted that they were false statements.

16. McManus testified that she had been bitten by Bubbles the Chimp; maybe it’s because Bubbles had a sixth sense in determining which Neverland employees would stab Jackson in the back, because he also bit Blanca Francia, not once but twice! (The second bite was probably because he knew that she would extort $2.4 million dollars from Jackson!)

17. Zonen attempted to end his redirect examination on a high note by leading McManus into discrediting her own deposition by stating that she was uncomfortable with her son being around Jackson because – wait for this! – Jackson would rub his fingers through her son’s hair! Oh, the horror!

18. Mesereau had a few brief questions for McManus under redirect cross examination, but the damage had already been done, and she was already discredited.

19. You can download a copy of the Neverland 5’s appeal of the $10,970.50 fine that was sanctioned against them; they claimed that they fine was “unwarranted and excessive”, and that the trial court “abused its discretion”. The appeal includes a detailed summary of the case: Kassim ABDOOL v Michael jackson

You can also read this post to see just how “well connected” McManus is with many other enemies of Jackson!

To be continued: https://michaeljacksonvindication2.wordpress.com/2012/12/22/april-8th-2005-trial-analysis-adrian-mcmanus-cross-examination-phillip-lemarque-direct-cross-examination-part-2-of-3/

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10 Comments leave one →
  1. lynande51 permalink*
    December 20, 2012 11:27 am

    They thought everyone would believe them because the tabloids had taught them that people would believe anything ridiculous about Michael.

    • nannorris permalink
      December 20, 2012 11:59 pm

      you are probably right…What a nightmare for him

  2. 170877 permalink
    December 20, 2012 8:48 am

    “Further, Mrs. McManus saw a book on masturbation and can also establish that Michael Jackson drank alcohol, particularly wine.”

    And?

    Did they realised how ridiculous they were?

    • shellywebstere permalink
      December 20, 2012 8:49 am

      Sorry, I made a mystake

  3. nannorris permalink
    December 19, 2012 7:14 pm

    This part..
    5 MR. MESEREAU: Let me rephrase that.

    6 Q. Did you tell the jury that Mr. Jackson gave

    7 you $300 to lie in a deposition?

    8 MR. ZONEN: Objection; misstatement of

    9 evidence.

    10 THE COURT: Overruled.

    11 You may answer.

    12 THE WITNESS: What I said was the $300 was

    13 given to me after Mr. Jackson had read the

    14 transcripts of Jordie Chandler.

    15 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Okay. And you interpreted

    16 that as a token of his appreciation?

    17 A. Yes, for covering up for him.

    18 Q. Okay. 300 bucks?

    19 A. Yes.
    I love how Mesereau just cuts to the heart of what Zonen was trying to imply and Zonen objects to it.
    —————
    And you had a number of meetings with Mr.

    23 Ring, Mr. Morgan, and the group that was suing

    24 Michael Jackson, true?

    25 A. Maybe two meetings that I can recall.

    26 Q. And Ralph Chacon was at those meetings,

    27 right?

    28 A. He might have been at one. I don’t know if 5431

    1 he was at all of them.

    that doesnt makle sense to me… I would think that if you really only thought there was 2 meetings , you dont say you didnt know if Ralph was at ALL of them, you would probably say EITHER of them.

    I would think bullet number 12 says it all , about her original deposition..when she says she couldnt tell if MJ had taken a shower with JC.
    If she was not telling the truth and was only trying to protect MJ, I would think the answer would have been NO, she has never seen them shower together.

    Must have been horrible to see these people come in and lie right to MJ face..

Trackbacks

  1. Michael Jackson > R. Kelly | Michael Jackson Vindication 2.0
  2. What the HELL is wrong with Wade Robson? Part 1 of 5 | Michael Jackson Vindication 2.0
  3. April 7th, 2005 Trial Analysis: Ralph Chacon (Direct & Cross Examination), Adrian McManus (Direct & Cross Examination), Part 5 of 5 « Michael Jackson Vindication 2.0

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