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April 13th, 2005 Trial Analysis: Jay Jackson (Cross Examination) and Janet Arvizo (Direct Examination), Part 4 of 5

April 22, 2013

Zonen moved on to the events of 2003, when Jackson called Gavin and invited him to Miami just prior to the airing of Bashir’s documentary in the United States, because they were in “danger” due to “this Bashir man”, and were receiving death threats:

22 Q. Now, let’s move on to 2003.


23 A. Okay.


24 Q. Did you receive a call from Michael Jackson?


25 A. Oh, yes.


26 Q. Did that call come to you or did it come to


27 another member of your family?


28 A. To Gavin. 6015


1 Q. At some point in time did you get on the


2 telephone with Mr. Jackson?


3 A. Yes.


4 Q. Had you had any other conversation with Mr.


5 Jackson prior to that day?


6 A. Prior to this day?


7 Q. Yeah. Prior to that day.


8 A. Zero.


9 Q. Zero. All right. Now, we’ve already talked


10 about that first visit where you were face to face


11 with Mr. Jackson.


12 A. Yes.


13 Q. Was there ever any occasion other than that


14 first visit back in August of 2000 where you were


15 face to face with Mr. Jackson up until this phone


16 call in February of 2003?


17 A. Zero.


18 Q. Was there ever any occasion where you had a


19 telephone conversation with Mr. Jackson?


20 A. Never. Except —


21 Q. Listen to the whole question. We’re going


22 to drive the reporter nuts if we don’t let each one


23 finish.


24 A. I’m sorry.


25 Q. Okay. Prior to this telephone conversation


26 in February —


27 A. Okay.


28 Q. — was there ever any occasion at all where 6016


1 you had a conversation with Mr. Jackson over the


2 telephone?


3 A. No.


4 Q. Now, do you know the date of this telephone


5 call?


6 A. I’ve come to find out per the investigation,


7 but I still always forget. The only way I know is


8 because he had told me about it, and it had aired in


9 England prior to it airing here. So consider the


10 time difference and all that. So definitely before


11 it aired here, and after it aired over there.


12 Q. In England, all right. Tell me what you


13 think is the date of that first appearance, if you


14 know. If you don’t know, just say so.


15 A. No, I don’t know.


16 Q. Was it early February?


17 A. Yes.


18 Q. Now —


19 A. I mean, it — every time they tell me, I —


20 I remember, but —


21 Q. It’s all right. It’s all right.


22 Now, at the time of this telephone


23 conversation from Mr. Jackson, were you aware of the


24 documentary titled “Living with Michael Jackson”?


25 A. No, not the documentary.


26 Q. All right. This is prior to your


27 telephone — we’re talking about prior to your


28 telephone call from Mr. Jackson? 6017


1 A. Yes.


2 Q. Did you have any personal knowledge that a


3 documentary had been prepared — listen to the


4 question — that a documentary had been prepared and


5 was titled “Living with Michael Jackson”?


6 A. No.


7 Q. Were you aware that such a documentary had


8 actually been shown in England?


9 A. No.


10 Q. Had your kids mentioned to you at any time


11 prior to this conversation with Mr. Jackson —


12 A. No.


13 Q. — that they had participated in a filming


14 of some kind?


15 A. No.


16 Q. Had the name “Martin Bashir” been raised in


17 your household up to that point?


18 A. No.


19 Q. Did you know who Martin Bashir was?


20 A. No.


21 Q. All right. The telephone call from Mr.


22 Jackson in early February that went to Gavin —


23 A. Uh-huh.


24 Q. — did you at some point get on the


25 telephone with him?


26 A. Yes.


27 Q. What did he tell you?


28 A. He had told me that — well, this is – 6018


1 Gavin’s talking to him first. He had told me that


2 Gavin was in danger, and that there had to be a


3 press conference because of this Bashir man.


4 Q. All right. Now, did you know what he was


5 talking about, this Bashir matter?


6 A. No.


7 Q. Did you ask him to explain that?


8 A. No.


9 Q. Did he offer any explanation as to what that


10 was?


11 A. No. At first I was telling him, “No, no,


12 no, no, no, no,” because he wanted him to come to


13 Miami. But when he told me, you know, “Janet,


14 David” —


15 Q. Mrs. Arvizo, why don’t you hold on a second.


16 We’re going to take it question by question.


17 A. Okay, sure.


18 Q. Listen carefully to the question asked, all


19 right?


20 A. Okay.


21 Q. Did he explain to you at any time what this


22 documentary was?


23 A. No. Not there, not on the phone.


24 Q. I understand — we’re just talking about the


25 phone conversation right now.


26 A. Oh, okay.


27 Q. Did he mention the name “Martin Bashir” in


28 this phone conversation? 6019


1 A. He just said “Bashir.”


2 Q. Okay. Did you know what that meant —


3 A. No.


4 Q. — at that time?


5 He said to you that your child was in


6 danger?


7 A. Yes.


8 Q. What did he say with regards to your child


9 being in danger?


10 A. That he was receiving death threats.


11 Q. Did —


12 A. That he was in danger.


13 Q. Did that alarm you?


14 A. Yes.


15 Q. Did you believe what he said at that time?


16 A. It’s until he — until he started telling me


17 that the children had shared with him about how


18 David was a bad guy, because my guard was here


19 (indicating). And when he started telling me those


20 things, oh, “waarrrrr.”


21 Q. All right. We’ll get to that in just a


22 second.


23 A. Okay.


24 Q. But right now with regards to your son being


25 in danger —


26 A. Okay.


27 Q. — did he describe the nature of the danger


28 to you? 6020


1 A. Just death threats because of this Bashir


2 thing.


3 Q. Did he tell you who the people were who were


4 issuing the death threats?


5 A. No.


6 Q. Did he use the word “death threats” or the


7 term “death threats”?


8 A. He said he was in danger.


9 Q. And did he mention any of your other


10 children in that regard?


11 A. No. Not until we got there.


12 Q. How long was your conversation with Mr.


13 Jackson?


14 A. Well, long enough to convince me.


15 Q. And approximately how long was that? Can


16 you say that it was longer than ten minutes?


17 A. I wouldn’t be able to tell you.

Next, Janet claimed that Jackson spoke to her about her ex-husband David, and said that the children had told him about David’s abuse, and that Jackson didn’t want her or her children around David anymore. This is news to me because neither Davellin, Star, nor Gavin ever testified to telling Jackson about their father’s abuse! And Janet testified that she never confirmed with her kids that they really did tell Jackson about their father’s abuse! (Essentially, she’s putting words in Jackson’s mouth that he obviously never said!)

18 Q. Now, at some point you said he started


19 talking with you about your ex-husband.


20 A. Yes.


21 Q. What did he tell you with regards to your


22 ex-husband?


23 A. He told me that the children had shared with


24 him what the children had gone through. And then he


25 had told me that he understands, and that he doesn’t


26 want the children nor me around David anymore; that


27 he’s a bad guy. And — you know. And to me — you


28 know. 6021


1 Q. All right. So he was — he was giving you


2 information —


3 A. Yeah.


4 Q. — about your ex-husband?


5 A. Yes.


6 Q. Now, what was your response to hearing that?


7 How did you respond to that?


8 A. I was, like, wow, he understands.


9 Q. Now, had your kids ever told you that they


10 had talked with him about David Arvizo?


11 A. No. That’s — no.


12 Q. Did that surprise you that he had that kind


13 of information?


14 A. Yes, but I believed him. I believed him.


15 And maybe they did, maybe my kids did.

16 Q. What did he ask you to do on this — in this


17 telephone call?


18 A. That Gavin — that he needed Gavin to do a


19 press conference, and he could protect him.


20 Q. Did he say where he was calling from, Mr.


21 Jackson?


22 A. Miami.


23 Q. And did he tell you where this press


24 conference was going to be?


25 A. In Miami.


26 Q. Did he tell you what he wanted Gavin to say


27 in this press conference?


28 A. No. I don’t remember. 6022


1 Q. Did you agree that Gavin could go to Miami?


2 A. No.


3 Q. What did you tell Mr. Jackson?


4 A. Well, I told him that if my son is in


5 danger, then me and my kids have to go.


6 Q. Did you ask him at any time if he contacted


7 the police?


8 A. No.


9 Q. Did you have any discussion with him about


10 what he was doing to remedy this problem, this


11 problem of danger?


12 A. No, I just trusted him.


13 Q. And I believe that you said — in your


14 answer again to the question of whether your son


15 would go to Miami, what did you say?


16 A. No.


17 MR. MESEREAU: Objection; asked and


18 answered.


19 THE WITNESS: I said no.


20 MR. ZONEN: I’ll withdraw the question.


21 I’ll withdraw the question.


22 THE COURT: All right.


23 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Did you come to an agreement


24 with Mr. Jackson as to who was going to go to Miami?


25 A. Yes, my kids and me.


26 Q. And “my kids,” did you mean all three?


27 A. Yes.


28 Q. Why did you want to do that? 6023


1 A. Well, because if Gavin’s going to be — you


2 know, if there’s death threats, then I guess we all


3 have to be together.


4 Q. Did he agree to that?


5 A. Yes.


6 Q. Did he say —


7 A. And actually, he’s the one that was going


8 that route.


9 Q. All right. And that was my next —


10 A. Because I had told him no.


11 Q. That was my next question. Who is it who


12 suggested that the whole family —


13 A. Him.


14 Q. You need to wait until the question is asked


15 in its entirety.


16 A. Okay.


17 Q. Who was this that suggested that the whole


18 family go to Miami?


19 A. Michael.


20 Q. Did you then agree to that?


21 A. Yes.


22 Q. Did he tell you when he wanted you and


23 the — and your children —


24 A. (Indicating) like that.


25 Q. You need to wait till the question is asked.


26 A. Okay.


27 Q. Did he tell you when he wanted you and your


28 children to go to Miami? 6024


1 A. Now.


2 Q. And by “now,” you meant immediately?


3 A. Immediately.


4 Q. All right. Was there some arrangement that


5 was made either by Mr. Jackson or by some other


6 person —


7 A. Him — oh, sorry.


8 Q. — or by some other person to get to you


9 Miami?


10 A. Yes, Michael and Evvy.


11 Q. Did somebody contact you after the telephone


12 call with Mr. Jackson?


13 A. Yes, Evvy.


14 Q. Yes. What was the arrangement that you were


15 going to have to get to Miami?


16 A. That Gary Hearn, his personal, like, driver,


17 the person who takes care of his cars, was going to


18 fly with us on a commercial air flight to Miami.


19 Q. And where were your children at the time of


20 this conversation?


21 A. Okay. Davellin was in school. And the boys


22 were not in school.


23 Q. Did you have to make arrangements to get


24 Davellin out of school?


25 A. No, actually Gary went to go pick her up


26 after school.


27 Q. And from where did he pick her up?


28 A. From — from — I don’t remember. I think 6025


1 it was — I think it was my mom’s. I think he went


2 to go pick her up from my mom’s or East L.A., one of


3 those. Best person to ask that is Davellin.


4 Q. Do you know where you were at the time of


5 this phone call from Mr. Jackson?


6 A. Yes.


7 Q. Where?


8 A. Our phone in East L.A. had been


9 disconnected. And so I had received a message


10 from — from Evvy that they had to be able to make


11 contact, so I was in Jay’s house.


12 Q. Where did that message come to?


13 A. What —


14 Q. The message that you received from Evvy was


15 forwarded through whom?


16 A. It was both, Evvy and Michael, to Jay’s.


17 Q. To Jay’s house?


18 A. Yes, because I had no phone at that time.


19 Q. All right. Did you return a phone call —


20 A. Yes.


21 Q. — or did they reach you there?


22 A. They actually — it was a combination of


23 everything.


24 Q. All right. Explain that.


25 A. They contacted me there, and I returned


26 phone calls from there to Evvy.


27 Q. To Evvy.


28 A. Yes. 6026


1 Q. And then Mr. Jackson personally called?


2 A. Yes.


3 Q. And that was the conversation that both you


4 and your son —


5 A. And Evvy had also left messages at my mom’s


6 house before that.


7 THE COURT: All right, Counsel. Let’s take a


8 break.


9 MR. ZONEN: Thank you.


10 (Recess taken.)


11 THE COURT: Go ahead.


12 MR. ZONEN: Thank you.


13 Q. Where we left off, you were talking about

14 the telephone call from Mr. Jackson.


15 THE BAILIFF: Turn your microphone on,


16 please.


17 MR. ZONEN: Thank you.


18 Q. Where we left off, we were speaking of the


19 telephone call with Mr. Jackson and the arrangements


20 for the trip to Florida before that. Let me ask you


21 a couple other questions.


22 A. Okay.

Zonen next questioned Janet about the tabloid reporters who contacted her after the Bashir documentary aired in England, but prior to the trip to Miami. Try not to laugh as you read what Janet said to the British reporters who told her that they saw Gavin in England!

23 Q. Had you been contacted prior to that phone


24 call from Mr. Jackson in that early part of February


25 by any member of the media or the press?


26 A. Yes.


27 Q. All right. Had you personally been


28 contacted? 6027


1 A. What happened, this is how it happened: Two


2 reporters — they said they were two reporters. Who


3 knows?


4 Okay. They had gone to my mom’s house. My


5 mom only speaks — my mom only speaks Spanish.


6 That’s it. These two men, one of them was the


7 speaker, kept telling my mom, “Gavin, cancer,” and


8 speaking in English.


9 And the only two things that stood out in my


10 mom, even though she knows only Spanish, like


11 certain words mean something to her.


12 And so they said, “Gavin, cancer; Gavin,


13 cancer,” and that stood out.


14 So my mom called me immediately, you know,


15 “What’s wrong with Gavin?” And she — I go, “No,


16 nothing’s wrong, Mom. They’re at school.” And she


17 goes, “Well, there’s two men here telling me about


18 Gavin and cancer.”


19 And so she didn’t know, so I thought maybe


20 some — some medical — some —


21 Q. Let me stop you for a second.


22 A. Sure.


23 Q. This conversation was how long prior to the


24 phone call from Mr. Jackson?


25 A. With — I don’t understand.


26 Q. The conversation with your mother about


27 these two people who arrived.


28 A. Okay. They were still there while my mom 6028


1 was on the phone.


2 Q. I know. But this conversation was how long


3 prior to your conversation with Mr. Jackson. Was it


4 the same day?


5 A. It was — it was within hours that Evvy


6 contacted me next.


7 Q. All right. Now, are these the only two


8 members of the press who contacted your family?


9 A. Yes.


10 Q. And anybody else from the media contact your


11 family?


12 A. Oh, yeah. Afterwards.


13 Q. Afterwards?


14 A. Yes.


15 Q. But prior to your trip to Miami —


16 A. Prior to my trip, yes, that’s it.


17 Q. Did you ever actually speak with these two


18 people?


19 A. Well, my mom passed me the phone, and I


20 spoke to him.


21 And he says, “We just happened to see your


22 son in England.” And I go, “No, if my” — “I just


23 dropped off my son at school. And if he’s in


24 England, he’s in big trouble,” you know.


25 And so — and he was very vague. And I


26 said, “You scared my mom. She only speaks Spanish,


27 so please don’t continue talking to her.”


28 Q. Did you have an interview with either of 6029


1 these two people?


2 A. No.


3 MR. MESEREAU: Objection.




5 MR. MESEREAU: The witness had not completed


6 her response, I don’t think, Your Honor.




8 MR. ZONEN: You call it.


9 THE COURT: Why don’t you just ask another


10 question.


11 MR. ZONEN: Thank you.


12 Q. Did you actually have a conversation with


13 either of those two people over the telephone?


14 A. Yes. One of them.


15 Q. All right. Did that person identify himself


16 by name?


17 A. I think his name — he said, “I’m a reporter


18 from England. I just flew in and I have to fly out


19 immediately.”


20 Q. All right. Did he tell you what his name


21 was?


22 A. I think it was — I can’t — I think it was


23 Mr. Garner. I think that’s what it was.


24 Q. Garner or Gardner?


25 A. I think it was, yes.


26 Q. Did he tell you what publication he was


27 with?


28 A. No, he just said, “I’m a reporter from 6030


1 England. I just flew in, and I have to fly back


2 immediately.”


3 Q. Did he tell you that he wanted to have an


4 interview with you?


5 A. No.


6 Q. Did he discuss any particular issue with


7 you?


8 A. He was very vague. What he wanted was for


9 me to meet — to — to have a conversation with him,


10 and — but because he was vague, I didn’t want to


11 talk to him.


12 Q. Okay.


13 A. So I told him, “You’re scaring my mom. And


14 that’s not my house, that’s my mom’s house. I live


15 in Los Angeles.”


16 Q. All right.


17 A. And that was it.


18 Q. All right.


19 A. As best as I can recall.


20 Q. This was a telephone conversation from which


21 phone?


22 A. From my mom’s.


23 Q. You happened to be there at the time of the


24 call?


25 A. No, no. I’m over here in Los Angeles. My


26 mom called me because she was scared, because these


27 two guys were saying Gavin — and a whole


28 conversation. But the only thing that jumped out in 6031


1 my mom was “Gavin” and “cancer.”


2 Q. And then you called back from where?


3 A. There was no call back.


4 Q. All right. They called you when you were at


5 your mom’s?


6 A. No, no.


7 Q. Tell us —


8 A. I was in Los Angeles. My mom was courteous


9 and polite, you know. Handed her the phone, because


10 I wanted to know what the nature of their visit, why

11 they were saying “Gavin, cancer.”


12 Q. They were there in person?


13 A. Yes, yes. At my mom’s house.


14 Q. All right. Now, during the course of this


15 conversation, did you discuss Michael Jackson at


16 all?


17 A. No.


18 Q. Did they tell you they wanted to talk about


19 Michael Jackson?


20 A. No.


21 MR. MESEREAU: Objection; leading.


22 THE WITNESS: No. All they said was —


23 THE COURT: Overruled.


24 THE WITNESS: — they had seen Gavin in


25 England.


26 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: How long was this


27 conversation you had with him?


28 A. Just minutes. With the information that I 6032


1 just told you, if you want to time it, it’s about


2 that long.


3 Q. Was that the only conversation that you had


4 with either one of them?


5 A. That’s correct.


6 Q. On this day, prior to going to —


7 A. That day, only day.


8 Q. Never had any conversation —


9 A. Never.


10 Q. — thereafter?


11 A. Zero. Double zero.


12 Q. At some point in time, did your then


13 boyfriend, Jay Jackson —


14 A. Yes.


15 Q. — tell you that he had had conversations


16 with reporters?


17 A. Now I know, per this investigation. I know


18 a lot of things now per this conversation.


19 Q. Listen to the question, okay?


20 On that day prior to your going to Florida,


21 did Jay Jackson tell you that he had conversations


22 with reporters?


23 A. No.


24 Q. Did you have any conversation with Jay


25 Jackson prior to going to Florida about any


26 reporters at all?


27 A. No.


28 Q. Were you aware — did any other reporter try 6033


1 to contact you prior to going to Florida?


2 A. No.


3 Q. In the course of this conversation with this


4 person, Gardner or Garner, did he mention anything


5 about a documentary?


6 A. No.


7 Q. Did he mention to you anything about your


8 child having been on television?


9 A. He had said, “I have just seen Gavin in


10 England.”


11 Q. All right. And you weren’t certain what


12 that meant?


13 A. Yeah.

After testifying about the reporters, Janet was asked about her conversations with Jackson about the documentary, prior to the trip to Miami.

14 Q. All right. Now, when you were speaking with


15 Mr. Jackson on the telephone —


16 A. Uh-huh.


17 Q. — did you ask Mr. Jackson about whether or


18 not your child had been on television?


19 A. No, I didn’t ask him.


20 Q. You didn’t him ask that question?


21 A. No.


22 Q. Did he offer any information about that?


23 A. No, not really. He was vague.


24 Q. In the course of your conversation with


25 Michael Jackson, did he mention anything about this


26 documentary having —


27 A. He said only the Bashir —


28 Q. Listen to the entirety of the question. 6034


1 A. Okay.


2 Q. Did he say anything to you about this


3 documentary that had aired in England?


4 A. No.


5 Q. Did he mention the name of it, “Living with


6 Michael Jackson”?


7 A. No.


8 Q. Did he mention Martin Bashir?


9 A. He didn’t say “Martin Bashir.” He said


10 “Bashir.”


11 Q. All right. Did you ask him who that was or


12 what that was about?


13 A. No. Until Miami. I found out more things.

Here is Janet’s description of the trip to Miami:

14 Q. All right. Now, you then flew to Miami, I’m


15 assuming.


16 A. Yes.


17 Q. And with whom did you fly to Miami?


18 A. With Chris and the kids and me.


19 Q. Do you know — and Chris is Chris Tucker?


20 A. Yes.


21 Q. Do you know how he became involved at this


22 stage?


23 A. Evvy contacted him.


24 Q. Evvy contacted him?


25 A. Yes, but I didn’t know about this until I


26 got to the sidewalk, which Gary Hearn had meet us,


27 and he says, “Guys, there’s a change of plans,” and


28 that was it. 6035


1 Q. Did he then take you to a private —


2 A. No, he took us to Chris’s house, and we


3 spent some time there in Chris’s house because we


4 were waiting for Davellin to come. That’s when we


5 flew on a private jet.


6 Q. All right. And did you know that you were


7 going to be taking a private jet?


8 A. Not until Gary told me.


9 Q. And the private jet took you straight to


10 where?


11 A. Miami.


12 Q. And once in Miami, did they take you to a


13 hotel?


14 A. Yes.


15 Q. Which hotel did they take you to?


16 A. The Turnberry.


17 Q. Can you describe that hotel for us?


18 A. It looks like a Las Vegas kind of hotel,


19 except —


20 Q. Is it fancy?


21 A. Yeah. Without the slot machines.


22 Q. Without the slot machines.


23 All right. Now, did you meet up with Mr.


24 Jackson when you got there?


25 A. No. No. We got right there until — you


26 know that time between — before morningtime where


27 it’s really, really dark? That’s the time we


28 arrived. 6036


1 So we went straight to — dropped off Chris


2 in his room, and then we went to our room. And our


3 room was right underneath his room. And Chris, they


4 had set him up in a completely different building,


5 away from me and the kids.


6 Q. All right. And your — were you in a suite


7 of some kind?

8 A. It was a — it was two rooms connected. You


9 know, I don’t know if you know the hotels where you


10 lock it and then there’s two separate rooms? Well,


11 they had unlocked it.


12 Q. Excuse me. I’m sorry.


13 And you were there with the three children?


14 A. Yes.


15 Q. Now, when did you see Michael Jackson after


16 arriving?


17 A. In the daytime.


18 Q. Had you talked with anybody during the


19 course of the trip about this danger that Mr.


20 Jackson had spoken to you about?


21 A. No. No.

Janet testified that Jackson spoke with her and the children for 45 minutes about the “danger” that they were in, and how much he cared for them and was going to protect them. Janet emphasized that Jackson used a “very normal voice, very male voice” during their conversation, insinuating that Jackson’s high pitched voice was for publicity purposes only! And listen to how she described herself as she listened to Jackson. 

When Mesereau objected against Zonen interrupting Janet’s testimony, she replied in agreement and stated that there was still “more” to her story, and once it “pops up”, she’ll let him know. That one statement personifies EVERYTHING about Janet’s character, and this joke of a trial!

22 Q. When you got to the hotel, did you have a


23 conversation finally with Mr. Jackson?


24 A. Yes.


25 Q. How long had you been at the hotel before


26 you met up with Mr. Jackson?


27 A. Hours. Because we had arrived during that


28 time and it was — it was — it was already the day 6037


1 of.


2 Q. Who else was present during the course of


3 this conversation?


4 A. Okay. The conversation?


5 Q. Yes.


6 A. Just me and the kids and him.


7 Q. Did he talk with you about the issue of this


8 danger to the children?


9 A. Yes.


10 Q. What did he say?


11 A. He spoke to all three of my kids and me, and


12 he spoke in a very normal voice, very male voice.


13 This is where I became aware that all three of my


14 children were in danger. Told me to trust him,


15 believe him, he’s a father figure, be like — like a


16 father to all three of my kids. Basically telling


17 us he’s going to protect us, protect my kids; to do


18 everything that Ronald and Dieter tell him, because


19 this is what’s going to fix the problem.


20 He even had told me that he has read — he


21 knows what to do in this situation, because he’s


22 read hundreds of books on psychology, and he


23 knows — he knows what to do in these kind of


24 things, of what kind of frame of mind that these


25 people that were threatening my children are. He


26 had — he had cried. I just thought, you know, what


27 a nice guy, you know.


28 Q. Hold on one second. 6038


1 This conversation took about how long?


2 A. Oh, gosh. About maybe a — about 45


3 minutes.


4 Q. All right. Did you ask him specifically


5 about the nature of the threats to your children?


6 A. No, I was just like — I was just like a


7 sponge, believing him, trusting him.


8 Q. Did he tell you the nature of the threats to


9 your children?


10 A. Because of the Bashir thing.


11 Q. But did he tell you who these people were?


12 A. No.


13 Q. At any point in time did he say to you that


14 the police were or were not being contacted?


15 A. No.


16 Q. Did he ask anything of you or your children


17 while you were there in this meeting?


18 A. In this meeting, no. No.


19 Q. Do you know why you were in Miami?


20 A. To do a press conference.


21 Q. Did he talk with you about a press


22 conference —


23 A. No.


24 Q. — during this meeting?


25 He said something about Dieter and Ronald?


26 A. Yes.


27 Q. Were Dieter and Ronald people who you knew


28 prior to that day? 6039


1 A. No.


2 Q. Did you meet them that day?


3 A. Yes.


4 MR. ZONEN: All right. Your Honor, if I


5 could approach the witness, please.




7 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: I’m showing you two exhibits,


8 if I can, No. 17 and No. 18 – all right? – in


9 evidence. If you’ll take a look at No. 17, can you


10 tell us who that is?


11 A. That’s Dieter.


12 Q. And do you know Dieter’s last name?


13 A. I’ve come to find out per this


14 investigation.


15 Q. Just tell us —


16 A. Dieter Weizner.


17 Q. All right. No. 18, do you know who this


18 person is?


19 A. Ronald Konitzer.


20 Q. And those were the Ronald and Dieter that —


21 A. Yeah. Those Germans.


22 Q. And, in fact, are they German?


23 A. Yes.


24 Q. How do you know that?


25 A. Because they told me, and plus they speak


26 German.


27 Q. Spoke among themselves in German?


28 A. Yes, yes. 6040


1 Q. Did you meet them that day?


2 A. Yes.


3 Q. Is there anything else that Mr. Jackson told


4 you in the course of that meeting with him?


5 A. Oh, that he loves us; that he cares about


6 us; that we’re family; that we were in the back of


7 the line, now we’re in the front of the line, and


8 because he’s going to take care of us, protect us


9 from these killers.


10 Let me see. What else?


11 That he’s — that he’s not just a father


12 figure to Gavin, to Star and to Davellin.


13 Let me see. What else?


14 And he’s family to me and he’s family to the


15 kids.


16 Let me see. What else?


17 Q. Do you know if Mr. Jackson had ever had —


18 MR. MESEREAU: Objection. The witness has


19 not completed her answer yet.


20 THE WITNESS: Oh, there’s still more. When


21 it pops up, I’ll let you know.


22 THE COURT: Go ahead and ask your next


23 question.


24 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Do you know if Mr. Jackson


25 had ever had such a similar conversation with your


26 children?


27 A. With my kids?


28 Q. Yes. Prior to that day. 6041


1 A. Prior to the Bashir thing?


2 Q. Yes, where he talked about being family.


3 A. Yeah. In the initial visit in August, in

4 2000, all his — like, all his people, for example,


5 Evvy was the No. 1 one that was pointing out that,


6 “I want you to see Michael as like family, all” —


7 “We see him and view him only as a father figure,”


8 so —


9 Q. Do you know if Mr. Jackson has ever said


10 something like that to your children prior to Miami?


11 A. Actually, in a conversation with Gavin over


12 the phone, that’s when Gavin had told me one of the


13 conversations.


14 Q. All right. Did you then have conversations


15 with either Dieter or Ronald?


16 A. Prior to this?


17 Q. No. I think you had said that you never met


18 them prior to that.


19 A. Yeah, that’s right.


20 Q. After your conversation with Mr. Jackson,


21 and he gave you some direction with regards to


22 Dieter and Ronald, what specifically was it that he


23 told you to do with Dieter and Ronald?


24 A. To listen and do everything they say,


25 because they’re going to fix the problem.


26 Q. Now, did you then have a conversation with


27 either Dieter or Ronald?


28 A. Yes, I did. 6042


1 Q. Was it one or the other, or both?


2 A. Both.


3 Q. Was it at the same time or separately?


4 A. This was the same time.


5 Q. All right. And do you remember where you


6 were when that conversation took place?


7 A. In Miami.


8 Q. Were you in the hotel?


9 A. Yes, in his room.


10 Q. In Mr. Jackson’s room?


11 A. Yes.


12 Q. Was Mr. Jackson present?


13 A. Yes, he was. And he had sat me down, and he


14 said, “Sit down right here,” and those two sat next


15 to me.


16 Q. Okay.


17 A. And then Michael was there.


18 Q. Who did the speaking?


19 A. Who did the speaking first?


20 Q. Yes.


21 A. Because they were all speaking.


22 Q. Well, all right, that’s a valid point. Who


23 is it who began the conversation?


24 A. Well, Michael.


25 Q. And what did he say when all of you were


26 together?


27 A. He said, “This is Ronald and Dieter.”


28 Because he had already had that 45-minute initial 6043


1 meeting.


2 Q. I understand.


3 A. And that’s the point where he had taken off


4 the jacket and handed — and physically placed it


5 on Gavin.

Janet claimed that Jackson took off his jacket and told Gavin to wear it and not take it off:

6 Q. All right. Well, let me ask you about that


7 for a second. This was in the hotel room?


8 A. Yes.


9 Q. On the first day of your visit?


10 A. Yes.


11 Q. And it was the date of the flight, actually;


12 is that right?


13 A. Yeah, because we had arrived there right


14 before —


15 Q. In the morning?


16 A. Yeah.


17 Q. Now, he was wearing a jacket during the


18 course of this conversation?


19 A. Yes. Yes.


20 Q. And he took the jacket off?


21 A. Yes.


22 Q. And did what with it?


23 A. Yes.


24 Q. What did he do with the jacket?


25 A. It was kind of like a — it was after he was


26 done with the conversation. He took off his jacket,


27 and then he put it on Gavin. He told me he wanted


28 him to wear it and not to take it off. 6044


1 Q. Was Star there as well?


2 A. Yes.


3 Q. Was Davellin there as well?


4 A. Yes.


5 Q. And both Dieter and Ronald were there at


6 that time?


7 A. No, no. In the initial meeting with him?


8 Q. Yes.


9 A. Ron and Dieter were nowhere in sight of the


10 hotel room.


11 Q. But at the time he handed your son his


12 jacket, were either of them there?


13 A. No.


14 Q. Ronald or Dieter?


15 A. No.

Next, Judge Melville allowed Zonen to question Janet about statements that Ronald Konitzer and Dieter Weisner made to Janet about the “danger” that she was in, “solely for purposes limited to possible conspirator statements”. Janet testified that they wanted to know about the background information of her and her family.

16 Q. Now, let’s get to the conversation when


17 Ronald and Dieter are there.


18 A. Yes.


19 Q. Can you tell us what Ronald said during the


20 course of that conversation?


21 MR. MESEREAU: Objection; hearsay.


22 MR. ZONEN: Statement in furtherance.


23 THE COURT: (To the jury) All right. I’m


24 allowing this particular testimony for purposes


25 limited to possible conspirator statements. You may


26 only consider it for those purposes in accordance


27 with my earlier instructions.


28 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: I believe it was Ronald I had 6045


1 asked you about. Tell us what Ronald said during


2 this conversation.


3 A. Well, in this conversation, all they wanted


4 to know was basically of — of who I am, where I


5 lived, my brothers, my mother. Just basically


6 information from me and the kids. That’s all.


7 Q. Did you give them that information?


8 A. Yeah, I did.


9 Q. At some point in time — and was that with


10 Dieter, as well, during that conversation?


11 A. Yeah. Yes.


12 Q. Did they give you any direction?


13 A. No. There was just — they were just, you


14 know, wanting information about me and my kids. And


15 I had seen nothing incorrect about that, or wrong,


16 because, you know, we just had that powwow with


17 Michael.


18 Q. Did either one of them in this initial


19 conversation talk to you about a danger that your


20 children were experiencing?


21 A. In this one, no. No, they were just like


22 absorbing all the information that they possibly


23 could have.


24 Q. They were getting information from you?


25 A. Yes. From me and my kids. About our past,


26 our present.


27 Q. Was Mr. Jackson present during the

28 entirety – 6046


1 A. Yes.


2 Q. Please wait till the question’s answered


3 (sic) in its entirety.


4 A. Okay.


5 Q. Was Mr. Jackson there during the entirety of


6 that conversation?


7 A. Yes.


8 Q. Did he offer any other information during


9 that conversation that you haven’t told us about


10 yet?


11 A. Best I can remember, no.


12 Q. How long did you stay in Miami?


13 A. Okay. Arrived there at that night, was


14 there that day, that night they showed the “Living


15 with Michael Jackson” thing, which I wasn’t allowed


16 to watch, none of the children, and then the next


17 day we left.


18 Q. All right. So you were there two nights?


19 A. Yeah.


20 Q. And then the next day you flew back?


21 A. Yes.


22 Q. Let’s go back to that first day. Now,


23 you’ve described that first conversation that took


24 place with your kids, Mr. Jackson, Dieter and


25 Ronald.


26 A. Uh-huh.


27 Q. Did you have any subsequent conversations,


28 any other conversations that day with either 6047


1 Ronald —


2 A. No.


3 Q. — or Dieter?


4 A. They were busy at work, I know now.


5 Q. But did you have a conversation with either


6 one of them that day?


7 A. No. After that, after they absorbed all


8 that information, no.


9 Q. All right. Now, the next day, did you have


10 any conversation with either Michael Jackson or


11 Dieter or Ronald?


12 A. Just almost — almost the whole day that’s


13 when we had stayed in Michael’s room.


14 Q. You were there in Michael’s room that entire


15 time?


16 A. Yeah.


17 Q. All right. Did Mr. Jackson talk with you


18 during the course — was Mr. Jackson there during


19 that day?


20 A. Yes.


21 Q. So he was in the room with you and your


22 three children?


23 A. Yeah.


24 Q. For a good part of the day?


25 A. Well, the whole entire time, Michael was


26 there with the kids.

Janet claimed that she was asked by Dieter Weisner to sign “something”, which turned out to be an authorization for attorney Theodore Goddard to file a complaint on behalf of Gavin, which was signed on February 7th, 2003. Janet had no recollection of who Goddard was, or of what the actual document represented. The document turned out to be an official complaint against Bashir and his employer ITV.


11 Q. Did you have any conversation with either


12 Dieter or Ronald on this second day about anything?


13 A. Yeah, the — the two papers. One that


14 Ronald wanted me to sign that had nothing written on


15 there, and then when I asked him, “What is it?”


16 “No, no, no. Got to hurry up. We’re


17 running out of time,” and, “You want your kids to be


18 killed.”


19 And so I signed it.


20 And then the next time was Dieter. Dieter


21 had said that what Ronald did didn’t work. And he


22 had a pre — pre something, a paragraph that was


23 pre-written.


24 Q. All right.


25 A. And then he, in my writing, asked me to


26 write some things, and then he had me sign


27 underneath that.


28 MR. ZONEN: Counsel? I showed you this 6051


1 earlier.


2 May I approach the witness?




4 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: I’m going to show you an


5 exhibit numbered one — excuse me, numbered 807 for


6 identification, not yet in evidence.


7 Would you take a look at that document,


8 please?


9 A. Uh-huh.


10 Q. Do you recognize that document?


11 A. Yes. Not — just my signature.


12 Q. All right. Is your signature actually on


13 that document?


14 A. Yes. It’s actually in two different places.


15 Q. Do you have a recollection of signing that


16 document?


17 A. Not with this on here, and not with this on


18 here.


19 Q. All right.


20 A. And definitely I didn’t sign my name twice


21 on the same piece of paper. And there was no line


22 right here.


23 Q. All right. Well, let me ask you this


24 question: Is any of that your handwriting; any of


25 it?


26 A. Just my signature and my — my printed name.


27 Q. So the printed name, the handprinted name,


28 is your handprinting? 6052


1 A. Yes, sir.


2 Q. And the signature that’s above that is your


3 signature?


4 A. Yes, it is.


5 Q. There’s a second signature. Is that yours


6 as well?


7 A. Yes.


8 Q. Now, do you have a recollection at all of


9 signing a document twice?


10 A. Not — no, two different situation — two


11 different things. Two different papers.


12 MR. ZONEN: All right. Your Honor, I’m


13 going to move this exhibit into evidence at this


14 time.


15 MR. MESEREAU: No objection.


16 THE COURT: All right. It’s admitted.


17 MR. ZONEN: And may I publish this?


18 THE COURT: You may.


19 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: I’d like to read — the very


20 top part appears to be typed in. Would that be


21 correct?


22 A. Yes.


23 Q. All right. Let me read this to you out


24 loud.


25 Oh, you can make it larger? Perfect.


26 “I confirm that Theodore Goddard is


27 authorized by me to file this complaint on behalf of


28 my son, Gavin Arvizo.” The date is Miami, February 6053


1 7th, 2003.


2 Do you believe — do you believe that you


3 were in Miami on February 7th?


4 A. I think so.


5 Q. All right. Do you know who Theodore Goddard


6 is?

7 A. No.


8 Q. Were you ever told who Theodore Goddard is?


9 A. No.


10 Q. Have you ever seen a document that had this


11 sentence preprinted on it?


12 A. No, not when I was in Miami. Now, per you


13 guys’s investigation —


14 Q. Stop right there.


15 That’s the signature that’s directly


16 underneath it?


17 A. Yes.


18 Q. Put it down a little bit so we can get the


19 top — no, no, the other way. Yes. Just put it


20 down.


21 We have it now with the signature that’s


22 below it. And you’re telling us that that


23 handwriting is yours —


24 A. Yes.


25 Q. — and the signature is yours?


26 A. Yes.


27 Q. Do you remember a line being there?


28 A. No, I don’t. 6054


1 Q. You didn’t draw a line in there?


2 A. No, I didn’t.


3 Q. And you have no recollection of a line being


4 there at the time you signed it?


5 A. I have no recollection of a line being


6 there.


7 Q. All right. Let’s move down.


8 Okay. “Mrs. Arvizo also learned that


9 Davellin and Star have been on T.V. without her


10 consent. Please act accordingly.”


11 And then there’s a signature. Did you sign


12 that?


13 A. I didn’t sign that, but that is my


14 signature.


15 Q. All right. The paragraph that says — that


16 begins with, “Mrs. Arvizo also learned…,” is that


17 your handwriting?


18 A. No. That’s my handwriting — that’s my


19 printing up there.


20 Q. All right. And the —


21 A. There’s a difference.


22 Q. Okay. And that particular paragraph, have


23 you ever seen that paragraph before?


24 A. Never.


25 Q. Now, do you have a recollection of signing


26 any document twice?


27 A. On the same piece of paper? No.


28 Q. Did anybody ever talk to you about a lawsuit 6055


1 while you were in Florida?


2 A. No.


3 Q. Did anybody ever mention an attorney in


4 England?


5 A. No.


6 Q. Did anybody talk to you about your being


7 represented or your son being represented?


8 A. No.


9 Q. While you were there on this first day of


10 conversations that you had with Dieter or with


11 Ronald or with Mr. Jackson, did anybody talk to you


12 about the presentation of “Living with Michael


13 Jackson”?


14 A. No.


15 Q. Did you at any time learn what that was?


16 A. Afterwards.

Next, Janet testified that she wanted to see “Living With Michael Jackson” because she was curious as to why she was “in danger”, according to Jackson, Konitzer, and Weisner.

17 Q. All right. Now, you had mentioned earlier


18 that there was going to be a showing of —


19 A. Yes.


20 Q. — “Living with Michael Jackson”?


21 A. Yes.


22 Q. Do you remember when that was presented in


23 the United States, on what day?


24 A. No. When I was there with him all day —


25 Q. Yes.


26 A. — that night.


27 Q. It was that night?


28 A. Yes. 6056


1 Q. Of the first full day that you were in


2 Miami?


3 A. Yes.


4 Q. All right. Did you want to go watch that?


5 A. Yeah, I wanted to go see what has caused my


6 kids to — you know, all of a sudden there’s death


7 threats on them.


8 Q. Now, you said “kids.”


9 A. Yeah.


10 Q. Earlier —


11 A. Yeah.


12 Q. Hold on, hold on.


13 Earlier, when you were in Los Angeles, you


14 had mentioned that the threat was directed toward


15 Gavin.


16 A. Yes.


17 Q. Did that change?


18 A. Yes.


19 Q. All right. What changed? Who told you that


20 it had changed?


21 A. Michael.


22 Q. What did he say?


23 A. That now it was all three of my kids.


24 Q. All right. Mr. Jackson told you all three


25 of your children were in danger?


26 A. Yes.


27 Q. All right. Now —


28 A. And that’s where that whole 45-minute 6057


1 speech —


2 Q. When did you learn that there was going to


3 be this presentation of a documentary titled “Living


4 with Michael Jackson”?


5 A. After — after Ronald and Dieter extracted


6 all this information from me, then afterwards.


7 Q. Did you know what that was? Did somebody


8 explain to you what that was?


9 A. No.


10 Q. Did somebody explain to you that your


11 children were in it?


12 A. They had mentioned that my children were in


13 it.


14 Q. Did anybody tell you the manner in which


15 they were depicted in that?


16 A. No.


17 Q. Did anybody say anything about this


18 documentary in terms of whether it was complimentary


19 or not complimentary?


20 A. No. Zero.


21 Q. With whom had you talked about “Living with


22 Michael Jackson”?


23 A. At this point, the initial meeting. Then


24 the Ronald and Dieter with Michael. Afterwards, let


25 me see, they kept pulling Gavin into — Ronald,


26 Dieter and Gavin (sic) kept pulling Gavin into a


27 room by himself. I was thinking they’re talking


28 about the press conference. Then Michael kept 6058


1 pulling Gavin into a room all by himself over and


2 over. So it was in the middle of the pulling Gavin


3 into the bedroom.

4 Q. Okay. All right. Now, at some point you


5 knew this was going to be on T.V.; is that right?


6 A. Yes.


7 Q. Yes. Who was it who told you it was going


8 to be on T.V.?


9 A. Actually — actually, I had overheard


10 Michael with Ronald and Dieter talking. I overheard


11 it.


12 Q. All right. But when did you first learn


13 that your children were involved in this


14 documentary?


15 A. When I overheard it.


16 Q. All right. So they had mentioned that?


17 A. Yes.


18 Q. All right. Now, did you make an effort to


19 go view it?


20 A. Yes, I did.


21 Q. Did you know what time it was going to be


22 on?


23 A. Yes. Because I overheard it.


24 Q. Did you, in fact, view it?


25 A. No, I didn’t.


26 Q. And why not?


27 A. Because when I ran down, Davellin had called


28 me to the room and told me that Michael was angry, 6059


1 to, “Come now,” so I went back up.


2 Q. All right.


3 A. And then Michael had talked to me and told


4 me he didn’t want me to see it.


5 Q. But he told you that?


6 A. Yes.


7 Q. Did he say why?


8 A. No.


9 Q. Did you ask him why?


10 A. No, I just — you know, I’m thinking,


11 “They’re going to take care of my kids from these


12 killers. I better” —


13 Q. Were you concerned at all about the content


14 of that documentary?


15 A. It’s until afterwards, I found out.


16 Q. I’m talking about now in Miami.


17 A. In Miami? No. I was clueless.


18 Q. Did you make any questions or any inquiries


19 as to how your children were depicted in that video?


20 A. Afterwards, yes.


21 Q. But in Miami.


22 A. In Miami, no.


23 Q. You didn’t ask either of the Germans?


24 A. No.


25 Q. And you didn’t ask Mr. Jackson?


26 A. No.


27 Q. And you didn’t watch it?


28 A. No, I didn’t. 6060


1 Q. To this day, have you seen this documentary


2 in its entirety?


3 A. Only the clips, the clips that the media


4 elects to put on there, little clips.


5 Q. But you have not —


6 A. But this is now.


7 Q. But you have not watched it in its


8 entirety?


9 A. No, I don’t want to watch it. Now I don’t


10 want to watch it.


11 Q. From the beginning to the end, you have not


12 seen it?


13 A. No.

Next, Janet testified that just prior to the trip back to Neverland from Miami, she was told by Jackson’s security that she should fly on a separate plane, but she complained about it and was ultimately allowed to fly with Jackson and her kids on his plane:

20 Q. Did you fly back with everybody else?


21 A. At first it wasn’t going to be like that.


22 Q. Did somebody talk to you about your flying


23 separately?


24 A. Yes.


25 Q. Who was that?


26 A. Big Mike, or his head security of traveling.


27 Q. Do you know his real name?


28 A. I don’t know his real name. 6065


1 Q. Is that the name he goes by?


2 A. That’s what they were calling him, Big Mike,


3 and he said, “I’m Big Mike.”


4 Q. Is he big?


5 A. Yeah, he is big.


6 Q. Okay. Is he the one who told you you were


7 flying separately?


8 A. Yes.


9 Q. Where did you — how did you understand your


10 children would be flying?


11 A. Okay. He had — he had called me and talked


12 to — to my room and told me that Michael didn’t


13 want me flying back with my kids; that he wanted


14 only my kids, and that I was going to have to take


15 the next-day flight out with their security.


16 And I was like, “No.” And then he’s saying,


17 “Yes.” And then I started crying on the phone, and


18 because I’m — you know, these are my kids, you


19 know, “what’s going on?”


20 I expressed to him, I said, you know,


21 remember how you wanted — did I express to him —


22 I did, to Mike, Big Mike —


23 Q. Now, you —


24 A. — my concerns.


25 Q. Did he then tell you you would be flying


26 with everybody else, or did somebody else tell you?


27 A. No, Big Mike said — after I started crying


28 on the phone, and he says, “I’m going to talk to the 6066


1 boss, and I’ll see what I can do.”


2 Q. Did somebody then call you back?


3 A. And then Big Mike called me back and said


4 then I could fly with the kids back to — with


5 Michael and just to stay quiet.


6 Q. Did you, in fact, fly with them back?


7 A. Yes, I did.


8 Q. Do you know how long that flight was?


9 A. No, it was just hours. I don’t know.

Janet was then asked to identify on a chart where everyone sat on the plane:

3 All right. Your Honor, I’d move to


4 introduce this Exhibit 808 into evidence.


5 MR. MESEREAU: No objection.


6 THE COURT: It’s admitted.


7 MR. ZONEN: May I publish this?


8 THE COURT: You may.


9 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: This is the interior of this


10 exhibit; is that correct?


11 A. Yes. Yes.


12 Q. Okay. I’m going to hand you the laser, if I


13 could, please. Press that little button right


14 there.


15 A. Okay.


16 Q. Now, you’ve indicated by the names “Gavin”


17 and “MJ,” “Star” and “Davellin” —


18 A. Yes.


19 Q. — as your three children and Mr. Jackson;


20 is that correct?


21 A. Yes.


22 Q. Would you show us where “MJ” is?


23 That’s Mr. Jackson’s seat. And does that


24 face directly ahead towards Davellin’s seat?


25 A. Yes, right there.


26 Q. And Gavin was next to him?


27 A. Yes.

28 Q. And that faces directly to Star’s seat? 6074


1 A. Yes.


2 Q. Okay. There is a “JJ” as we’re further to


3 the right. Is that you?


4 A. Me.


5 Q. All right. And that would stand for?


6 A. “Janet Jackson.”


7 Q. Janet Jackson. Okay.


8 Okay. Now, which direction was that seat


9 facing?


10 A. It faces in that direction.


11 Q. All right. You were not able to — from the


12 vantage point of where you were seated, you were not


13 able to see —


14 A. And then not only that, they’re really,


15 like, big in the back of me.


16 Q. The seats, you mean?


17 A. Yes.


18 Q. And you’re not hugely tall, are you?


19 Were you not able to see over the top of


20 that seat, then?


21 A. Yes. They’re not like these chairs. They


22 go past.


23 Q. It was up above your head?


24 A. Yes.


25 MR. ZONEN: All right. Let’s move that


26 down. Yes, this direction.


27 THE WITNESS: And so do theirs, too. Not


28 just mine. 6075


1 MR. ZONEN: Perfect. Right there.


2 Q. Tell us where Dr. Farshshian was.


3 A. Yes.


4 Q. And he was facing you?


5 A. Yes.


6 Q. And Patty and Grace?


7 A. Right here.


8 Q. And let’s move in the other direction.


9 And we have what appears to be four people


10 on that.


11 A. Yes.


12 Q. Would you describe that seat? What —


13 A. It’s kind of like a couch.


14 Q. Okay. Are there armrests at all?


15 A. I don’t remember that, but I just remember


16 that it looked like a couch.


17 Q. All right. And the four of them were on


18 that seat?


19 A. Yes.


20 Q. Now, there’s another seat that’s up above


21 that —


22 A. Right here.


23 Q. — what appears to be a couch. And who sat


24 there?


25 A. I don’t know.


26 Q. Was the stewardess seated at any time?


27 A. No, no, the stewardess always sat in the


28 back, because Grace would get mad at her and throw 6076


1 her in the back.


2 Q. All right.


3 A. Like she had to be working, because — and


4 if you were not working, you go back.


5 Q. All right. Now, was there a person seated


6 in that seat, the one that was directly above from


7 where the couch is?


8 A. I don’t remember.


9 Q. Do you know if there was another person on


10 the plane you don’t recall?


11 A. I don’t recall. But that’s — you know, I


12 don’t —


13 Q. All right. We can take that off, and if we


14 could turn the lights back on.

Zonen questioned Janet about an alleged incident that she saw on the plane, and before describing it, Janet TWICE looked to the jury and said “Please don’t judge me”, which was one of many erratic behaviors that she would demonstrate during her testimony. She testified that she saw Jackson licking Gavin’s head multiple times as he slept, and because everyone was asleep, she didn’t tell anyone, nor did she attempt to stop it. Notice how she contradicted herself on two consecutive questions when she first said that Star was the first person that she told about this event, and in the very next question she said the police were the first people that she told!

15 Now, at some time while you were on that


16 plane, did you see an event that caused you concern?


17 A. Yes.


18 Q. What did you see?


19 A. Um, okay. (To the jury) Please don’t judge


20 me.


21 Q. If you could, just answer the question.


22 Tell us what it was that you saw.


23 A. (To the jury) Please don’t judge me.


24 At that time I was — I hadn’t slept for so


25 long. When everybody had fallen asleep — and it


26 was hours into the flight. I hadn’t gotten up, and


27 so — and I figured this was my chance to look and


28 see what had — what was going on back there. 6077


1 So I got up, and that’s when I saw Michael


2 licking Gavin’s head.


3 I thought it was me. I thought I was seeing


4 things. I thought it was me.


5 When we got off the airplane and I asked my


6 son, I asked him, “Are you okay?” He said, “I’m


7 okay.” And that was it.


8 Q. Do you know if Gavin was awake or asleep at


9 the time?


10 A. He was asleep at the time.


11 Q. How could you tell?


12 A. Because his head was on his chest.


13 Q. Okay. Where was Mr. Jackson’s arms at that


14 time?


15 A. Like this.


16 Q. He had an arm around Gavin?


17 A. Yes.


18 Q. Now, I want you to describe what it was you


19 saw. You said you saw him lick him. What part of


20 his head?


21 A. Like this, over and over.


22 Q. All right. What part of his head was it?


23 Point to your head where it was.


24 A. Right here.


25 Q. Actually in his hair?


26 A. Yes.


27 Q. And do you mean the side of his head?


28 A. Yes. 6078


1 Q. Okay. And you said, “over and over.” How


2 many times did you see that?


3 A. It was just over and over.


4 Q. All right. Are we talking about a few


5 seconds’ worth or a few minutes’ worth? What?


6 A. I couldn’t tell you.


7 Q. All right. Did you say anything to


8 anybody —


9 A. No.


10 Q. — at that time?


11 A. I looked around to see if anybody was awake,


12 to see if anybody was seeing what I was seeing. And


13 everybody was asleep, that I could see. Like I took


14 a look at Patty and Grace, and I took a look at


15 Farshshian. They were asleep.


16 Q. Did you say anything to anybody at that


17 time?


18 A. No.


19 Q. Did you ever say —


20 A. I was never going to tell nobody.


21 Q. Did you say anything to anybody at any time


22 about that event?

23 A. No.


24 Q. Who was the first person you discussed that


25 with?


26 A. I didn’t discuss it with anybody until like


27 way, way after, way after Neverland —


28 Q. Okay. 6079


1 A. — when Star had told me what he had seen.


2 Q. All right.


3 A. And then there was like — everything went,


4 like, backwards.


5 Q. Okay. Who was the first person that you


6 told of your observation?


7 A. Me? I think it was the police.


8 Q. All right. So you had not told anybody


9 about this —


10 A. No.


11 Q. — until a conversation with the police?


12 A. No.


13 Q. Do you remember where in this flight that


14 happened, where during the flight?


15 A. After everybody had gone to sleep.


16 Q. Could you tell me how many hours into the


17 flight that was?


18 A. No. Everybody was just sleeping, that I


19 could see.


20 Q. Where did you —


21 A. Even the flight attendant, she was like


22 this. She was way, way at the end, and she was like


23 this.

Upon their return to Neverland, Janet claimed that she and Davellin slept in different guest units, while Gavin and Star slept in Jackson’s bedroom:

6 Q. Where did you stay that night when you


7 finally went to —


8 A. Neverland, in the guesthouse.


9 Q. Where was Davellin?


10 A. In — in one of the guesthouses.


11 Q. All right. Where were the boys?


12 A. With Michael.


13 Q. Do you know where with Michael?


14 A. In — now I know, okay.


15 Q. At the time did you know where they were?


16 A. At the time, no.


17 Q. You knew they were in the house?


18 A. Yes.


19 Q. Did you ever walk into the house during the


20 nighttime?


21 A. No.


22 Q. Did you ever make an effort to contact


23 either of the boys while they were inside the house?


24 A. No.


25 Q. Did you take your meals inside the house?


26 A. Me?


27 Q. Yes. During this time?


28 A. During — yeah, you need to specify. 6085


1 During — prior to leaving with Jesus, in the


2 kitchen area.


3 Q. All right. Now, when you got there on


4 this — at this hour, you spent the night there and


5 presumably woke up and left your room the next


6 day.


7 A. Yes.


8 Q. Do you have a sense of what time that was


9 when you finally came out?


10 A. I think it was — I think it was


11 mid-morning. I think it was morning, mid-morning.


12 Q. Was Davellin with you?


13 A. No, Davellin was with Marie Nicole, Baby


14 Rubba.


15 Q. Did Davellin stay the night in your room?


16 A. Not in my room. In a guesthouse.


17 Q. In a different guest cottage?


18 A. Yes.


19 Q. Do you know where Marie Nicole or Aldo


20 stayed, or Baby Rubba?


21 A. Oh, Marie Nicole stood in the room — they


22 have a bed over there above the theater. There’s a


23 bed. That’s where she slept. And Aldo and the


24 boys, they slept with Michael.

Next, Janet was presented with a press release from Bell Yard that included comments that were attributed to her, and she denied ever speaking with them.

27 Q. All right. I’d like to show you an exhibit,


28 if I may. 6087


1 Is this in evidence?


2 (Off-the-record discussion held at counsel


3 table.)


4 MR. ZONEN: Madam Clerk, let me just confirm


5 that 405 is not in evidence.


6 THE CLERK: It is not.


7 MR. ZONEN: Not? Not in evidence.


8 May I approach the witness, Your Honor?




10 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Showing you an exhibit at


11 this time for identification not in evidence, No.


12 405, I’d like you to take a moment and read it, if


13 you would, please.


14 A. Okay.


15 Q. It’s a full page. Take your time to go


16 ahead and read it to yourself.


17 A. Okay.


18 Q. When you’re done, just set it down.


19 A. Okay.


20 Q. You have completed reading this; is that


21 correct?


22 A. Yes.


23 Q. All right. Do you know who Bell Yard is?


24 A. No.


25 Q. Does this appear to be a press release?


26 A. I don’t know.


27 Q. All right. Are you quoted in this document?


28 A. Yes. 6088


1 Q. Have you ever made those quotes?


2 A. No.


3 Q. Did anybody ever interview you as to the


4 content of this document?


5 A. No.


6 Q. Have you ever seen this document before?


7 A. No. Right now.


8 Q. This is the first time you’ve seen it?


9 A. Yes.


10 Q. All right. It’s attributed to Janet


11 Ventura-Arvizo; is that correct?


12 A. Yes.


13 Q. The date is Sunday, the 9th of February,


14 2003?


15 A. Yes.


16 Q. Did anybody contact you on that date about


17 releasing any kind of a press conference — a press


18 release?


19 A. No.


20 MR. ZONEN: Your Honor, I would move to


21 introduce 405 into evidence.


22 MR. MESEREAU: Objection. Hearsay; no


23 foundation.


24 THE COURT: I don’t think there is a


25 foundation. I was looking. It was identified on


26 March 2nd, but I can’t recall who identified it.


27 MR. ZONEN: It was Ann Gabriel, I believe.


28 Let me withdraw the introduction of this 6089


1 until we can do this at another time, for the


2 convenience of the jury. We can debate the issue at

3 that time.


4 THE COURT: That would be good.

Zonen pivoted to the topic of Janet’s first “escape” from Neverland with Jesus Salas. She claimed that she asked Dieter Weisner and Ronald Konitzer for permission to leave, but they denied it because they wanted her to shoot the rebuttal video. Pay attention to when Janet states that Michael Jackson and the fie unindicted co-conspirators “ended up being the killers”!!

5 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: How many days did you stay at


6 Neverland?


7 A. I can’t remember. Until Jesus helped me.


8 Q. Give us a sense of it. Two days? Five


9 days?


10 A. No.


11 Q. Do you have a sense of it at all?


12 A. No, I don’t have a sense of it.


13 Q. Okay. And you say that Jesus helped you


14 leave?


15 A. Yes, he did. And he got into it before


16 that.


17 Q. Hold on. Listen to the question that I ask


18 and only answer that question, if you would. Okay?


19 A. Okay.


20 Q. Now, did you ask anybody to — did you ask


21 anybody to take you back to Los Angeles before going


22 to Jesus?


23 A. No.


24 Q. Did you express to anybody a desire to leave


25 Neverland?


26 A. Yes.


27 Q. To whom did you —


28 A. To Ronald and Dieter. 6090


1 Q. To Ronald and Dieter?


2 A. Yes.


3 Q. Was Mr. Jackson present during the entirety


4 of that time?


5 A. Yes.


6 Q. For the period of time until Jesus took


7 you —


8 A. Yes.


9 Q. — home?


10 When you asked Ronald and Dieter to leave,


11 what did they tell you?


12 A. That I had — no, because I had to do the


13 rebuttal.


14 Q. Ahh, all right. A rebuttal?


15 A. Yes.


16 Q. Was this the first time that you had any


17 information about a rebuttal?


18 A. Right on.


19 Q. All right. And who was it who first spoke


20 to you about a rebuttal?


21 A. It was Ronald and Dieter.


22 Q. Together?


23 A. Yes. First it was Ronald. And then it was


24 Dieter, and then it was both, and they — you know,


25 they took turns.


26 Q. You had multiple conversations with them?


27 A. Yes. But Dieter, before Ronald, was


28 preparing us for that. 6091


1 Q. Okay.


2 A. Which I didn’t know.


3 Q. What do you mean, preparing for you that?


4 A. They had this — this thing that I guess —


5 they had extracted all the information from us. It


6 was like a script.


7 Q. They got information from you. Do you mean


8 about your family?


9 A. Back in Miami.


10 Q. All right. But —


11 A. And whatever else they did.


12 Q. Did anybody ever talk to you about a


13 rebuttal while you were in Miami?


14 A. Never.


15 Q. So it wasn’t until you got to Neverland?


16 A. Yes.


17 Q. Who was the first one to broach that subject


18 with you?


19 A. Dieter.


20 Q. Did Michael Jackson talk to you about doing


21 a rebuttal?


22 A. No. When I spoke to him, he said, “Do


23 everything that Ronald and Dieter tell you, and it


24 will fix everything.”


25 Q. Did you have any conversation back at


26 Neverland with Michael Jackson at all?


27 A. The initial — when I first got there, I


28 expressed it to him, and he said, “Do everything 6092


1 that Ronald and Dieter tell you to do.”


2 Q. What he had previously said in —


3 A. Yes.


4 Q. — Miami —


5 A. Yes.


6 Q. — he said again?


7 A. Yes.


8 Q. Did you express to him your concerns at that


9 point about Ronald and Dieter?


10 A. No.


11 Q. Did you have concerns about Ronald and


12 Dieter at that point?


13 A. Yes. It escalated towards the middle-end.


14 Q. What did either one of them tell you about


15 this rebuttal? What did they tell you that was


16 going to be?


17 A. In answer to — in answer to everything of


18 the “Living with Michael Jackson.” They were


19 concerned about how he looked. They weren’t


20 concerned about my children, me, anything else.


21 Only him.


22 Q. Did they explain to you what the rebuttal


23 had to do with your children’s safety?


24 A. Yeah, “That” – this is another phrase –


25 “that would appease the killers.” I heard that so


26 many times here, it’s just —


27 Q. All right. Somebody actually used the word


28 “killers”? 6093


1 A. Yes.


2 Q. Who?


3 A. Him. Michael. Ronald. Dieter. Later on,


4 Frank, Vinnie. And you know what? They ended up


5 being the killers.


6 Q. All right. I want you to listen to the


7 question that’s being asked, and only ask that


8 question — answer that question.


9 A. Okay.


10 Q. Answer this question only, all right?


11 Now, who was the first person who mentioned


12 to you “killers”?


13 A. Michael.


14 Q. Where was that?


15 A. That was in Miami.


16 Q. Now, the rebuttal, did you know what you


17 were doing a rebuttal to?


18 A. On all — the answer to the questions of


19 this “Living with Michael Jackson,” Martin Bashir.


20 Q. Now, you hadn’t seen it; is that correct?


21 A. I hadn’t seen it.


22 Q. Did somebody explain to you the content of


23 that?


24 A. No. They just — it was a script, and that


25 was it, and expressed — worked with us daily,


26 numerous times, on what to do, what to do in between


27 the outtakes, what to do before, and that’s it.


28 Q. Who was it — who talked to you about a 6094


1 script?


2 A. Dieter.


3 Q. Did he show you one?


4 A. Yes.


5 Q. Something in writing; is that correct?


6 A. Yes.


7 Q. Did he present this script to you that you


8 were actually able to read it?


9 A. Yes.


10 Q. What types of things were on the script?


11 A. Just glowing things about Michael.


12 Q. Did he say to you why glowing things about


13 Michael would protect your children?


14 A. Yeah, “That that would appease the killers.”


15 Q. All right. Now, did you tell them that you


16 would do this rebuttal?


17 A. No. Prior to Jesus, it was a no.


18 Q. And why did you say no?


19 A. Because I told them, “What’s wrong with the


20 truth?” And that’s it.


21 Q. All right. Now, did you —


22 A. I had no problems saying something nice, you


23 know.


24 Q. Did they tell you —


25 A. But when I had a 45-minute powwow when I got


26 there, I believed everything he said.


27 Q. Did they tell you that this rebuttal would


28 have not just you, but your children in it? 6095


1 A. At Neverland?


2 Q. Yes.


3 A. Yes.


4 Q. So who was it who told you that the rebuttal


5 would feature all of you?


6 A. Ronald and Dieter.

To be continued……

17 Comments leave one →
  1. callgirl82 permalink
    April 27, 2013 7:07 pm


    I was specifically referring to MJ’s comment where he told Bashir “I’ve slept in bed with many children. I sleep in bed with all of them”..This is the very statement that the prosecution was using against him in the hopes of getting a conviction. This was not a very smart thing to say especially after being accused of child molestation on more than one occasion. He opened the door for more ridicule from the media and another investigation by people like Gloria Allred and Sneddon who believed that he was a child molester and were more than happy to see him destroyed. There is no doubt that Martin Bashir is an unethical lying little twerp, but MJ fed right into his plan which was to paint him as a pedophile. He made sure to ask him controversial questions because he was fishing for controversial answers, and MJ gave him exactly what he wanted, and this is the very thing he used against him. This is why I wish he had better judgement and thought thoroughly before answering the questions..This goes for any celebrity. When you are being interviewed, you should always be careful what you say and what you do when you are in front of that camera because the camera picks everything up, and once the editors have the footage, they have the power to cut it up and twist it any way they want. It’s all the matter of what you say and what you do. I just wish he never the documentary period..Biggest mistake he ever made in his life.

    • sanemjfan permalink
      April 30, 2013 4:22 pm

      Thank you for reading and commenting on our blog. We appreciate thoughtful, respectful, and articulate comments from our readers.

      I think that it’s a foregone conclusion that MJ made many mistakes in his life, and at times he was very naïve and gullible. Nobody here denies that. But regardless of his poor judgment at times, he didn’t deserve to be mistreated and taken advantage of the way he was. The goal of this blog is to show exactly how the prosecution ran wild and exploited a dysfunctional family in order to bring trumped up charges against an innocent man, and we like to keep the focus on the prosecution’s decisions, and not the victim’s decisions.

      We’re knee deep into our summary and analysis of this trial, and out of nowhere you left a comment about MJ’s poor judgment regarding the Bashir interview, and letting kids sleep in his bedroom, but at this point that is water under the bridge. It just seems so redundant and out of place to dredge up that topic again. It’s nothing personal against you, and we’d really like you to keep reading the blog and leaving comments. We’ve had this argument with lots of other fans before, who leave off-topic comments about MJ’s poor judgment that have nothing to do with the particular post that they’re commenting on.

      Having said that, yes, you’re right; MJ should have known better than to trust Bashir, and shouldn’t have done the documentary in the first place. But he did, and there’s nothing we can do at this point, so there’s no need to beat a dead horse. Let’s focus on the scumbags who conspired to bring MJ down.

  2. April 27, 2013 12:09 am

    The tongue licking is great.

    Original claim was that Janet waited until everyone was asleep and just as she got up she conveniently “saw Jackson repeatedly licking Gavin on the side of Gavin’s head.” She described his tongue as being “a big long white tongue. His tongue is like white.” No explanation given for why his tongue could humanly be white, but there ya go, she saw it, must’ve happened. She claims she thought she was imagining things and did not tell her children about it.

    Star claimed he had overheard Janet telling Jay Jackson she had seen the head licking.

    So she originally claims she told nobody, then claims the first person she told was Star directly, then also the first person was the police, and Star contradicts that and claims he’d overheard her mother telling Jay! None of them could even properly corroborate each other.

  3. stacy2 permalink
    April 25, 2013 4:57 pm

    As much as I dislike Gavin for what he did to Michael Jackson, I have to admit that I do kind of feel sorry for him. He had a lot of suffering in his life and had gone through so much all before the age of 18. First he had very bad parents: a father who abused him verbally and physically, and a mentally ill mother who used him as a puppet to scam people. I think it is admirable that this young man has managed to overcome so much hardship in his life-including cancer and surviving all of his mother Janet’s schemes, and being thrust into the public spotlight and exploited by that unethical hack Martin bashir and having to go through the kind of media scrutiny that no kid should have to endure as a result of the trial, mostly thanks to the scheming adults around him..But all of this is no excuse to falsely accuse someone of something as horrible as sexual abuse. I can have sympathy for Gavin the child, but not Gavin the adult. I hear he has no sympathy for what he did, and like his brother star, talks crap about MJ..

  4. stacy2 permalink
    April 22, 2013 10:12 pm

    it’s amazing how these people can lie under oath so blatantly and not have anything happen to them..

  5. nannorris permalink
    April 22, 2013 8:38 pm

    this part
    3 Q. Is there anything else that Mr. Jackson told

    4 you in the course of that meeting with him?

    5 A. Oh, that he loves us; that he cares about

    6 us; that we’re family; that we were in the back of

    7 the line, now we’re in the front of the line, and

    8 because he’s going to take care of us, protect us

    9 from these killers.

    10 Let me see. What else?

    11 That he’s — that he’s not just a father

    12 figure to Gavin, to Star and to Davellin.

    13 Let me see. What else?

    14 And he’s family to me and he’s family to the

    15 kids.

    16 Let me see. What else?

    17 Q. Do you know if Mr. Jackson had ever had –

    18 MR. MESEREAU: Objection. The witness has

    19 not completed her answer yet.

    20 THE WITNESS: Oh, there’s still more. When

    21 it pops up, I’ll let you know.
    Well I can certainly see why Mesereau let her babble on.
    I remember reading that Zonen kept looking at Mesereau , hoping he would object during Janet testimony, and he wouldnt, ,….much to Meserau’s advantage of course.

    All those detectives on the case and no one questioned why Janet said everyone on the plane was asleep, and she supposedly saw MJ licking Gavins head, but then Starr claims to have witnessed this also.
    Lucky for the Arvizo family , whenever one of them is being physically or sexually abused, there is always one or more of them, witnessing the offensive behavior

    • lynande51 permalink*
      April 23, 2013 9:38 am

      She will let them kow when more pops up.Kind of tells you the whole story right there.

    • stacy2 permalink
      April 23, 2013 1:59 pm


      yeah it’s called “built-in corroboration”..This is where one person tells the other person something then the other person backs it up to make their story seem more compelling and believable..what a low-life immoral family.

      • nannorris permalink
        April 23, 2013 7:52 pm

        Yeah I know..incredible how many obvious signs these sheriffs and DA office chose to ignore and look the other way, just so they could find somebody , ANYBODY that would be willing to get up on the stand and lie , so they can pass Go and collect..
        Sneddon was equally blind to facts back in 93, because he saw headline and ambition.
        . June Chandler was telling these cops , Evan was thrilled when he heard Jordan met MJ because he would be SET FOR LIFE…It was all about money..
        I was watching the video of Mj defending himself from Neverland and it is so painful to watch , the mans life is being destroyed over BS.
        One thing I found kinda interesting is that they took pictures of his crotch and torso , supposedly because of the lying sack Jordan , but he also says he has to submit to one of their doctors to determine if he has vitalago or any other skin disorders ..
        Why would that be??
        If the supposed victim is describing his privates as splotchy or what ever, why is it nessecary for another doctor to confirm the cause of it ..That he actually had vitalago, as opposed to what ??, just bleaching his skin? or are they looking for yet another reason why splotches can change , so they can continue to go forward with this crap., when it doesnt match..
        What a nightmare for MJ..
        This whole thing was a travesty from day one, and I really resent , , how all these people , not just the parents , but the DA and the Media and Larry Feldman all used children for their own gain.Not one of these people who are supposedly protecting children , gave a hoot about these kids,,Probably the only adult involved who was NOT using/abusing children , was Michael..
        Imagine how he felt when all his friends children were interviewed about such an awful subject.., pertaining to HIM!!..Talk about mental cruelty

        • callgirl82 permalink
          April 23, 2013 10:06 pm


          Yes it’s sad what we had to endure, but in fairness, he kind of brought it on himself. I do not believe that he was guilty, but when you go on national tv and tell the world that it’s “very loving” to take other people’s children to bed with you, especially after paying out millions of dollars to young boys who accused you of sexually molesting them, you are ASKING for trouble. He had been warned before that having children sleep over was not a good idea and that the behavior is inappropriate and unacceptable, but he continued to defend it and even tried to rationalize it as if it was perfectly normal. It took false charges and a humiliating trial for him to finally come to reality. He had extremely poor judgement and that is why bad things always happened to him, and because of that, his legacy will sadly forever be associated with pedophilia.

        • sanemjfan permalink
          April 23, 2013 10:41 pm

          Thank you for taking the time to leave a respectful and articulate comment. I believe that is the first comment that you’ve left on this site, right? I don’t recall seeing any other comments from you before.

          I’ve heard many, many people share those same sentiments throughout the years, especially during the trial, and after his death, and I think that a lot of the criticism that MJ regarding his judgment comes from the misconceptions that people have about him, Neverland, and the “sleepovers” that he had with many families.

          While MJ certainly wasn’t as articulate as he could have been when he spoke about sharing his bed with kids, you have to remember that he was ambushed into that topic by “journalist” Martin Bashir, who lied to him both before and during the filming of the documentary by telling him that he would get a chance to review and edit the final product before it aired. Instead of keeping his word, Bashir never allowed MJ to view it, and he added his own negative and false commentary to the documentary, which included the blatant lie that he though that Neverland “was a dangerous place for children”. You can watch the entire documentary, and MJ’s rebuttal, right here and see for yourself how Bashir falsely edited the footage to make MJ look like a child molester:

          Also, in that scene with Gavin Arvizo, Bashir told Gavin to hold MJ’s hand and put his head on MJ’s shoulder just prior to the filming of that scene, and he made sure his cameraman zoomed in on them holding hands in order to creep people out. Journalist Aphrodite Jones confirmed that Jackson’s attorneys Mesereau and Brian Oxman told her about this deception in these interviews:

          Many people think that if MJ had not allowed Gavin to sleep in his bedroom during his first visit to Neverland in August 2000, he wouldn’t have been accused, but that is also totally false! Did you know that Janet Arvizo, Gavin’s mom, plotted to try to extort MJ by accusing him of showing her kids online porn during their first visit? Gavin’s sister Davellin Arvizo told their family friend Carol Lamere about this, and she told Mesereau’s investigator during a pretrial interview. Here is what Lamere had to say:

          In 2000, Davellin lived with Lamere because Davellin was not getting along with Janet, who was dating a police officer rumored to be a pedophile. “Davellin hated being with Janet, she cried whenever she was on the phone with Janet”, Lamere commented. Davellin told Lamere that Janet would wake her up in the idle of the night, would hit her and demand that she do things like clean the house or run to the store. Davellin also complained to Quai about Janet’s abusive behavior. Lamere noticed that when Davellin came over, she smelled and was not bathing.

          At this time, Davellin told Lamere that Michael was going to buy her family a big house. After questioning Davellin about what she meant, Lamere figured out that Davellin was implying that Janet was going to blackmail Michael, forcing him to buy the family a house. The plan was to accuse the client of showing the children how to log on to adult websites. Davellin acted as if she did not know how to use the internet until she met the client. Lamere became upset and told Davellin that it was wrong to falsely accuse someone of wrongdoing. Davellin became flustered and scared and then said she was joking. Shortly thereafter, Lamere called Evi Tavaschi and told her to “get Michael away from the Arvizo kids.”

          And if Janet had gone through with her plan, Sneddon would have moved heaven and earth to bring a bogus trial to court, and the media would have still crucified MJ as “guilty” before it had even started! You can read Lamere’s complete statement on pages 26-33 of this document:

          Many people also believe that MJ “should have learned his lesson” after 1993 and stopped helping kids altogether, but he didn’t feel the need to do so because he was 100% innocent, and it wasn’t some random family that falsely accused him, but a family that he invited into his life and became very close with. In 2000, it was the Arvizo family that requested to meet MJ, not the other way around, and after the first few initial meetings, there wasn’t any more contact with the family until Sept. 2002, when Gavin and Star were included in that scene.

          I respect what you’re trying to say, but I think that you probably don’t have a complete knowledge of all of the events that led up to the trial in 2005. I’m trying to humanize MJ to you, and let you see the rationale behind his decision to help the Arvizo family, and many others. While the statements about bed sharing certainly hurt MJ in the court of public opinion, in the court of LAW they were irrelevant because Sneddon was on a witch hunt for MJ, and he would have used anyone making a false claim against MJ to bring charges. If you take the time to study the trial from top to bottom, and learn all of the facts, you’ll see just how malicious and vindictive the PERSECUTION, not prosecution, of MJ really was!

          From what I gathered from your comment, and please correct me if I’m wrong, you believe that MJ invited kids to sleepover, and forced them to sleep in his bed, all without the permission of their parents? Is that what you think?

        • lynande51 permalink*
          April 24, 2013 10:16 pm

          It was not Michael that invited Gavin into his bedroom that night.The Arvizo boys begged and he first told them to ask their parents who agreed to them sleeping in there. Frank Cascio was in the room the entire night. This was the only child outsde of relatives that was allowed in his room after 1993.Someone also found out that the ony way to get to meet Michael after 1993 was if yor child was dying.That is why Janet Arvizo exaggerated the severity of Gavins illness.

        • April 27, 2013 12:06 am

          Lyn – Star testified that Paris and Prince were also in that room the entire night they were there. So it was Star and Gavin on the bed, MJ’s two kids, Michael and his assistant Cascio on the floor – kind of a packed crowd for a man seeking to drag random kids he can molest in private.

          This is the only night they slept in MJ’s room.

        • nannorris permalink
          April 27, 2013 12:36 pm

          Yeah and supposedly they were on the internet looking at porn.It would be comical if it didnt destroy someones life
          Michael is put on the spot by these kids,and he tells them they would have to ask their parents ..
          According to Frank, they said they already did..
          So he extends a kindness to a(SUPPOSEDLY) dying child who(supposedly) lives in poverty , by allowing them to sleep in the same bed he would put his own children in.
          But makes sure Frank is there, to protect himself

          It is a very generous and humble thing to do..
          And Bashir knew exactly what he was saying and twisted it for his own purposes..
          The accusations the Arvizo made mirror their own behavior , because they were grooming MJ , with their cards and phone calls.
          I would love to hear Zonen explain Gavins own testimony of him being angry and hurt because MJ was AVOIDING him, after their first visit to the ranch

    • sanemjfan permalink
      April 28, 2013 6:42 pm

      Thanks for catching that! I can’t believe I missed that comment! LOL! I guess after reading over 13,000 pages of testimony, it’s easy to miss a few important lines here and there. 😦

  6. lynande51 permalink*
    April 22, 2013 1:30 pm

    Lord this woman is bonkers!!!.


  1. April 13th, 2005 Trial Analysis: Jay Jackson (Cross Examination) and Janet Arvizo (Direct Examination), Part 3 of 5 | Michael Jackson Vindication 2.0

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