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April 18th, 2005 Trial Analysis: Janet Arvizo (Cross-Examination), Part 3 of 4

June 30, 2013

After returning from recess, Mesereau questioned Janet about the itinerary for the trip to Brazil, which she acknowledged that she saw, but didn’t tell Jay Jackson until after she had left Neverland for the last time. Janet claimed that she was forced to sign all of her documents relating to getting visas and passports, while being followed by “killers” who trailed her from building to building. They had threatened to kill her parents, so that is why she never attempted to call authorities or notify the employees of those government buildings.

28 THE COURT: All right. Mr. Mesereau, you may 6663


1 proceed.


2 THE BAILIFF: Turn your microphone on,


3 please.


4 MR. MESEREAU: Oh, I’m sorry.


5 Q. Miss Arvizo, when the prosecutor was asking


6 you questions about the Brazil trip, he showed you


7 an itinerary, which is in evidence. Do you remember


8 that?


9 A. Yes.


10 Q. It’s a typed itinerary giving departure and


11 arrival times, correct?


12 A. This is correct.


13 Q. And he showed it to you. Do you remember


14 that?


15 A. Yes.


16 Q. And you identified it as something you were


17 aware of, right?


18 A. I came to find out after.


19 Q. Well, the itinerary says you’re leaving Los


20 Angeles for Sao Paulo, Brazil, on March 1st, 2003,


21 right?


22 A. Okay.


23 Q. It says you’re returning from Sao Paulo,


24 Brazil, to Miami on March 6th, 2003, correct?


25 A. Uh-huh.


26 Q. And it says you’re leaving Miami for Los


27 Angeles on March 7th, 2003, correct?


28 A. Uh-huh. 6664


1 Q. That was the itinerary you were shown about


2 the trip, correct?


3 A. Yes.


4 Q. Did you ever see any plane tickets that were


5 actually purchased for the trip?


6 A. No. Just like my visa and passports.


7 Q. And you never discussed that trip with


8 anyone other than who, Frank and Vinnie?


9 A. This is correct. Frank, Vinnie, and the


10 initial meeting, in that 45-minute meeting where


11 Michael said if things got so bad we would have to


12 leave the country.


13 Q. And you never told Jay Jackson about the


14 Brazil trip?


15 A. I didn’t tell Jay anything until when I


16 permanently left Neverland. That’s when I told Jay.


17 Q. Okay. Did you tell Jay Jackson you had


18 gotten passports?


19 A. I told Jay everything after we came out


20 of — permanently out of Neverland.


21 Q. Did you tell Jay Jackson you’d gotten a


22 visa?


23 A. I told Jay everything after we had left


24 permanently out of Neverland. That’s the best I can


25 remember.


26 Q. Now, at some point, you must have met with,


27 it appears to be Vinnie, and filled out some of


28 those documents, correct? 6665


1 A. Vinnie never left our side the majority of


2 the time.


3 Q. Excuse me?


4 A. The majority of the time, Vinnie never left


5 our side.


6 Q. And did you sit down with him and fill out


7 the documents so you could apply for a visa?


8 A. No.


9 Q. Do you know where he got the information


10 that went onto those forms?


11 A. They had already studied me. They already


12 had acquired all the information they wanted,


13 needed.


14 Q. Did you ever sign any forms; do you know?


15 A. Yes, I did. Yes, I signed them.


16 Q. And where did you sign those forms?


17 A. I think — the best I can remember, I think


18 actually there at the facility.


19 Q. Which facility is this?


20 A. Where they were doing the — where they were


21 doing the — processing it.


22 Q. Is that a federal facility, to your


23 knowledge?


24 A. Yes, it is.


25 Q. Did you sit down and do — work that out


26 with Vinnie? Is that how it worked?


27 A. It was already filled out by Vinnie.


28 Q. And did you and your children sit down with 6666


1 him and sign anything, to your knowledge?


2 A. No, we didn’t sit down.


3 Q. Okay. But you — what I think you’re


4 saying, and correct me if I’m wrong, you completed


5 those documents at the federal facility, right?


6 A. Incorrect.


7 Q. Is that incorrect?


8 A. That’s incorrect.


9 Q. All right. Where did you just tell the jury


10 you sat down to finish those forms?


11 A. Never sat down. Vinnie had already all that


12 information pre filled out. All I did was sign it.


13 And that’s the best I can remember.


14 Q. Okay. And then you took a trip to the —


15 was it a consulate you went to?


16 A. No.


17 Q. What buildings did you go to to get your


18 passport, visa, and all the documents you needed to


19 take this trip to Brazil?


20 A. Everything was done in steps. First it was


21 the birth certificate. Then the passport. And then


22 the visa.


23 Q. Do you know how many buildings you went to


24 to get all this done?


25 A. Three different buildings.


26 Q. And which — identify those buildings, if


27 you can remember.


28 A. The birth certificate, the passport and the 6667


1 visa place.


2 Q. And was it always you, Vinnie and your


3 children?


4 A. Yes, plus the people that were following us.


5 They never left our side.


6 Q. Did these people that you have not


7 identified who were following you ever enter the


8 buildings?


9 A. Yes, they did.


10 Q. So they were just mixing in with the crowds


11 in the buildings?


12 A. Yes.


13 Q. And is that what prevented you from ever


14 telling any officer or employee, “Help us, we’re


15 being kidnapped”?


16 A. Mostly because my parents’ life were now in


17 danger.

Here is arguably the most laughable piece of testimony from the entire trial! Janet told police that she was told by Frank, Ronald, Dieter, and Vinnie that they had various ways to make her children disappear, including the power to fly them away from Neverland in a hot air balloon. Sneddon should truly be ashamed of himself for allowing this witness to be anywhere near the witness stand!

18 Q. Now, you told the sheriffs at one point you


19 thought your family might disappear in a hot air


20 balloon from Neverland, correct?


21 A. He’s taking it out of context. I had


22 informed the police that — that Frank and Vinnie


23 had expressed to me that they had many ways to —


24 and also Ronald and Dieter, remember, and Ronald and


25 Dieter were replaced by Frank and Vinnie, and that


26 they had many various ways to make my children


27 disappear. And I was expressing it, but he’s


28 minimizing it. 6668

1 Q. Did you tell the sheriffs that you thought


2 your family might disappear in a hot air balloon


3 from Neverland?


4 A. Again, he’s minimizing it. I told him what


5 I told the police what Ronald and Dieter, Frank and


6 Vinnie had said; that they had various ways to


7 make — transporting my children and making them


8 disappear. And what was most terrifying is when it


9 was towards the end, now they had the passport, plus


10 visa.


11 Q. Did you ever mention a disappearance in a


12 hot air balloon? Yes or no.


13 A. I made them aware that they had a variety of


14 ways of getting my children out and that was one of


15 them. This isn’t me. This is what your Frank and


16 Vinnie said, plus your Ronald and Dieter. So I’m


17 just communicating to the police what I was told.


18 Q. And some of them — somebody mentioned to


19 you disappearance in a hot air balloon, right?


20 A. This is one of a variety of ways.

After repeatedly telling Janet that she “told the jury” about various parts of her story, Judge Melville admonished Mesereau and asked him to stop that practice because everything that she testified to is told to the jury, and it is redundant for him to keep saying that:

21 Q. Okay. Now, you said you went to the child


22 support hearing, correct?


23 A. Yes.


24 Q. Your lawyer, Michael Manning, was there,


25 right?


26 A. Yes.


27 Q. And the night before, you stayed at Major


28 Jackson’s, correct? 6669


1 A. This is correct.


2 Q. And the night after the hearing you stayed


3 at Major Jackson’s, correct?


4 A. The night of the hearing, yes.


5 Q. And you never complained to anyone at the


6 courthouse about these problems you’ve identified,


7 right?


8 A. This is correct.


9 Q. And I think you told the jury, correct me if


10 I’m wrong, that you never told Jay Jackson about


11 these problems either the night before the support


12 hearing or the night after it, right?


13 A. The night of March 10th.


14 Q. Is that correct?


15 A. This is correct. I told him that night


16 everything.


17 Q. You told him the night of the hearing?


18 A. The March 10th, which was the day before the


19 hearing.


20 Q. Okay.


21 THE COURT: You know, Counsel, I’m going to


22 ask you to refrain from saying, “You told the jury.


23 You told the jury.” Everything that she says here


24 she told the jury.


25 MR. MESEREAU: Okay.


26 THE COURT: It’s just an improper reference


27 on your behalf. You ask her for the facts, and


28 they’ll listen to it. 6670


1 MR. MESEREAU: I will do that, Your Honor.

Janet was a party to a lawsuit against ITV that she knew nothing about; there was litigation that Anne Kite testified about that attempted to get the Bashir documentary off of the air.  There was also an effusive statement about Jackson’s relationship with the Arvizo children that was attributed to Janet, but she said the quote was dictated to her by Dieter Weisner. She never saw the quote in any British newspaper.

Janet had the audacity to call the late Ed Bradley a “dishonest man”, so please read this post to see exactly how he secured his February 2003 interview with Jackson (before it was cancelled at Jackson’s request), and his denials that CBS paid Jackson for the December 2003 interview.

2 Q. You appeared at a hearing in this courthouse


3 on September 17th, 2004. Do you remember that?


4 A. Yes, this is correct.


5 Q. And at that point in time, you were


6 represented by Attorney Larry Feldman, true?


7 A. No.


8 Q. Would it refresh your recollection if I just


9 show you the transcript?


10 A. I think what I’m clear on, he was helping us


11 every time something was happening.


12 Q. I asked you, “You are represented currently


13 by Mr. Feldman, correct?” And you said, “Yes,”


14 right?


15 A. Yes. Yes.


16 Q. Now, when you first hired Attorney


17 Dickerman, one of the things you wanted him to do


18 was stop any use of your children’s likeness or


19 photos in any media-type event, correct?


20 A. Yes. This is correct.


21 Q. And did you say earlier that you were


22 involved in a proceeding in England against Bashir


23 that you didn’t know about?


24 A. This is correct. Mr. Dickerman came to find


25 out afterwards.


26 MR. ZONEN: I’ll object as nonresponsive


27 beyond, “This is correct.”


28 THE COURT: Sustained. 6671


1 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Are you saying that you


2 were a party to a lawsuit in England that you knew


3 nothing about?


4 MR. ZONEN: Objection. Speculative; lack of


5 foundation.


6 THE COURT: Overruled.


7 THE WITNESS: This is correct.


8 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: And when did you find out


9 that you were represented by a lawyer in England in


10 a lawsuit against Bashir and his company?


11 A. That Michael was involved in.


12 Q. I’m sorry, excuse me?


13 A. That Michael was involved in. I came to


14 find out this.


15 THE COURT: The question was when. When did


16 you find out?


17 THE WITNESS: Oh. Summer. In about the


18 summer.


19 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: And what summer was that?


20 A. 2003.


21 Q. Okay. And did you come to learn that some


22 statements had been attributed to you in some


23 British newspapers about the Bashir documentary?


24 A. Yes, I came — I came to find out a lot of


25 things through this investigation, what they were


26 doing.


27 Q. Did you ever see a document that was titled


28 “Recommended Statement by Janet Ventura to the UK 6672


1 Sunday Telegraph”?


2 A. I don’t know what you’re talking about. But


3 I know that Ronald and Dieter were heavy at work.


4 Q. Okay. Do you know if they were preparing


5 any statement to be released quoting you?


6 A. I came to find out that Ronald and Dieter


7 were using my children, like Michael was using my


8 children. Everybody was exploiting and using my


9 children. Now I’ve came to find out many things.


10 Q. Okay. And let me rephrase the question.


11 Did you ever find out that anybody had


12 prepared a statement attributed to you to be


13 released to a British newspaper?


14 A. I gave no authority, no interviews, no


15 nothing.


16 THE COURT: Just a minute. He’s asked


17 you —




19 THE COURT: — two or three times if you know


20 about a statement. That’s the only question he’s


21 asked you. Do you or not?



23 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Did you have any


24 communication during the first three months of 2003


25 with an attorney named David LeGrand?


26 A. No, I didn’t.


27 Q. Okay. Did you ever even hear his name


28 during that period? 6673


1 A. Yes, I did.


2 Q. And when did you first learn about an


3 attorney named David LeGrand?


4 A. Okay. Michael had called over the


5 60 Minutes, Ed Bradley. This was all part of the


6 choreography. And Dieter pointed this out, and


7 Ronald over the telephone, that this interview was


8 never going to take place. It was just per


9 Michael’s choreography. And that Ed Bradley was a


10 dishonest man and they were using him for their


11 choreography.


12 And David LeGrand’s purpose — Michael’s


13 attorney was there as part of their choreography, to


14 let them know that this interview was not going to


15 take place. He was used. That’s what happened.


16 Q. Did you — I’m sorry, go ahead.


17 A. No, it’s okay.


18 Q. Did you ever tell anyone to include the


19 following words in a recommended statement by you to


20 the Sunday Telegraph newspaper in England —


21 A. No.


22 Q. — “The relationship that Michael has with


23 Gavin, Star and Davellin is a beautiful, loving


24 father, son and daughter. He is their Daddy


25 Michael. And to me and my children, he is our


26 family. He cares for them as a good, loving father.


27 Michael is their only father figure who loves and


28 cares about them. They are not fatherless, because 6674


1 they have their Daddy Michael. My family consists


2 of unconditional love.”


3 Did you ever tell anyone to use those words?


4 MR. ZONEN: May I see the document, please,


5 Your Honor?




7 MR. ZONEN: Go ahead.


8 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Did you ever give words to


9 that effect to anyone to be used in a statement by


10 you?


11 A. I think I’m recalling something. Remember


12 how they put those two — that page that had, like,


13 two signatures on there? And I told you that one of


14 my — them, one of them was my signature, but it had


15 been moved, I can tell, because of where it was.


16 MR. ZONEN: I’m going to object as


17 nonresponsive to the question of whether or not she


18 used those words.


19 THE COURT: I’ll sustain that objection. But


20 I’m going to ask counsel to simplify the question a


21 little bit. It’s a little cumbersome the way it


22 stands.


23 MR. MESEREAU: Okay. May I approach, Your


24 Honor?


25 THE COURT: Yes.


26 MR. MESEREAU: Thank you.


27 THE WITNESS: Here it is. There it is.


28 Uh-huh. 6675


1 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Have you had a chance to


2 look at that document?


3 A. Yes. Yes, I have.


4 Q. Have you had a chance to read those words?


5 A. This is where they took my signature from.


6 Q. Okay. Have you had a chance to look at it?


7 THE COURT: Just a minute. Just look at the


8 words that counsel wants you to look at.


9 Would you show her which paragraph you’re —


10 MR. MESEREAU: Yes, Your Honor.


11 THE WITNESS: Yes. Yes, yes.


12 THE COURT: You’re showing her two


13 paragraphs?


14 MR. MESEREAU: Yes, Your Honor. I am.


15 Well, I’m showing her —


16 THE COURT: Which one are you going to ask


17 her the question about?


18 MR. MESEREAU: I’m showing her one sentence


19 in one paragraph and a — well, it’s really one, but


20 there’s some handwritten stuff that I’m asking her


21 to look at.


22 THE COURT: Well, you need to address with


23 her what you’re trying to show her so that she can


24 answer any questions.


25 MR. ZONEN: Your Honor, could we mark this


26 item as an exhibit?


27 THE COURT: No. He was refreshing her memory


28 with it. 6676


1 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Ms. Arvizo, I’m just


2 asking you if you know where the following words


3 came from.


4 A. Yes, from Dieter.


5 Q. Okay.


6 A. Dieter had — they added that second


7 paragraph right now. But all it was was —


8 THE COURT: Just a minute. There’s no


9 question pending.


10 THE WITNESS: Oh, okay.


11 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Okay? Do you remember the


12 words I read?


13 A. No, you didn’t read any.


14 Q. Okay. Let me just read them and see if you


15 know where those words came from.


16 A. Okay.


17 Q. Okay? “The relationship that Michael has


18 with Gavin, Star and Davellin is a beautiful, loving


19 father, son and daughter. He is their Daddy


20 Michael. And to me and my children, he is our


21 family. He cares for them as a good, loving father.


22 Michael is their only father figure, who loves and


23 cares about them. They are not fatherless, because


24 they have their Daddy Michael. My family consists


25 of unconditional love.”


26 Have you heard those words before?


27 A. Yes. This is when — when Mr. Zonen was


28 doing his — when he was speaking with me, I had 6677


1 told you that my signature had been moved, because


2 Dieter had a pre — preprinted paragraph, and then


3 in my — in my own writing, he had me write


4 something. So, yes, that is right before we left


5 Miami.


6 Q. Well, if you knew about this, did you know


7 about the lawsuit?


8 A. No.


9 Q. So you did know about a statement that was


10 supposed to be attributed to you to appear in a


11 British newspaper, right?


12 A. No. No, no, no.


13 Q. Do you know whose writing that is that I


14 just showed you?


15 A. This is my writing that I’ve already told


16 the jurors.


17 Q. So you wrote those words, correct?


18 A. Yes, per Dieter’s dictation.


19 Q. You wrote those words on a statement to be


20 released Friday, February 7th, 2003, correct?


21 A. No. It wasn’t a statement that was going to


22 be released. What Ronald had done — Dieter had


23 told me that what Ronald had done did not work to


24 appease the killers. And there’s that phrase, and


25 that’s a quote.


26 Q. And there’s a heart that’s written in


27 between the printing, and that’s a heart that you


28 wrote, correct? 6678


1 A. Yes.


2 Q. And then you see “XOXOXO,” meaning “Love,”


3 right?


4 A. Yes. That’s —


5 Q. And that’s your writing, correct?


6 A. Yeah. That’s correct. I used to be that


7 kind of person. Now I’m like this (indicating) hold


8 up. I’m putting one hand over my heart.


9 Q. And your writing is inserted into a printed


10 statement, right?


11 A. Yes. They have — by the way, he’s shown me


12 the paper. That bottom paragraph was not there.


13 Q. Are you saying that you wrote these words


14 and put a heart and put “XOXOXO” in Florida?


15 A. Yes. This is correct.


16 Q. And does the date February 7th, 2003, sound


17 right to you?


18 A. It must be right.


19 Q. Okay. And the printed portion of the


20 statement says, “I am appalled at the way in which


21 my son has been exploited by Martin Bashir and


22 Granada Television,” correct?


23 A. That’s what Dieter had written.


24 Q. And that’s the way you felt, right?


25 A. No. They had told me that this would —


26 what Ronald had did does not work and this would


27 appease the killers. So I was fooled.


28 Q. Well, are you saying you didn’t know this 6679


1 was to be released in England?


2 A. Exactly.


3 Q. And you’re saying you didn’t know that there


4 was going to be a lawsuit in England in which you,


5 your children, and Mr. Jackson were going to sue


6 Bashir and Granada Television?


7 A. This is correct. Money doesn’t buy


8 happiness. That’s why when I found out through Mr.


9 Dickerman —


10 MR. ZONEN: Objection; nonresponsive.


11 THE WITNESS: — I put a stop to it.


12 THE COURT: Sustained. There’s no question


13 pending.


14 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Did you ever see an


15 article that appeared in a British newspaper the


16 next day, February 8th, 2003, that quoted you?


17 A. No.


18 Q. Did you ever talk to anyone who claimed to


19 represent a British newspaper at any time?


20 A. I think — I think when those two people


21 that had came before we left to Miami that had


22 scared my parents, and they kept saying, “Gavin,


23 cancer; Gavin, cancer.”

Next, Janet denied ever being so poor that she had to live in a stable with horses, which is a statement that was attributed to Jamie Masada in the media:

24 Q. Ms. Arvizo — oh, sorry.


25 Miss Arvizo, did you ever tell anyone that


26 you were living in a stable with hay and horses in


27 Bakersfield?


28 A. No. 6680


1 Q. Ever say anything to that effect to anyone?


2 A. No.


3 Q. Did you ever hear or learn that you were


4 quoted as saying that?


5 A. Yeah. I came to find out a lot of things.


6 Q. When did you find out that you were quoted


7 as saying that you and your family were so poor you


8 were living in a stable with hay in Bakersfield?


9 A. Just recently. I’ve never lived in


10 Bakersfield.


11 Q. Did you ever learn that Jamie Masada had


12 quoted you as saying that?


13 MR. ZONEN: I’ll object as lack of


14 foundation and assumes facts not in evidence that


15 Jamie Masada said she lived in Bakersfield.


16 THE COURT: Sustained; foundation.

Here is the story that quotes Masada as saying that Janet and her family lived in a barn with horses:

“Surviving on benefits, single mother Arvizo brought up her three children Davelin,16, Gavin, 12, and Star, 11, in a run-down district of Los Angeles before Jackson lifted the family out of poverty. But it was Jamie Masada, who runs a summer camp for under privileged children which the Arvizos attended, who brought the family and Jackson together”


They were living in a stable with the hay and the horses for a long time, Masada said.”

It was also said in this article, although the quote wasn’t attributed to Masada:

Meanwhile, Arvizo’s divorced parents used the British tabloids to air their differences, both personal and philosophical. “Michael has pet names for all of my children, and Gavin even calls him Daddy,” said mom Janet Ventura-Arvizo, 34, who was once so poor that she temporarily lived in a horse stable with her children. “He is the father they never had.” She said Gavin and siblings Star, 11, and Davelin, 16, “are hoping to spend a lot more time with him in the future.” Dad David, 37, countered that Janet, a former waitress, “sees prestige for herself from the connection.” He said that while Jackson “has been very generous to the kids, [he] should not be sharing a room with them.”,,20139344,00.html

Next, Janet began to deny making exculpatory statements about Jackson to the DCFS social workers, despite the fact that Mesereau was reading directly from the transcript:

17 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Now, the document that you


18 just admitted adding language to, was that presented


19 to you at the hotel in Florida?


20 A. Yes, it was.


21 Q. And you read that before you inserted all


22 these words?


23 A. No, I didn’t. I completely trusted them.


24 Q. Did you know it was supposed to be a


25 recommended statement by you?


26 A. What?


27 Q. Did you know the document you were inserting


28 words into was titled “A Recommended Statement” by 6681


1 you?


2 A. No. I didn’t read it. I completely trusted


3 them.


4 Q. Well, why would you add language to an


5 already existing paragraph if you didn’t know what


6 was in the paragraph?


7 A. Because Dieter dictated that. Everything


8 was — at that point was like a state of panic.


9 That’s how Ronald and Dieter were behaving.


10 Q. So you just filled out what you were told to


11 fill out and never read a thing, correct?


12 A. Yes, I completely trusted them. I did.


13 Q. Let me get back to what you told the social


14 workers on the 20th, okay? You told them, “My


15 children are never solely alone with Michael


16 Jackson,” true?


17 A. Incorrect.


18 Q. You didn’t tell that to them?


19 A. That’s correct.


20 Q. Okay.


21 A. And let me remind you —


22 MR. ZONEN: Objection; no question pending.


23 THE COURT: Sustained.


24 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: You told the social


25 workers, Mrs. Arvizo, “There’s always someone


26 around,” right?


27 A. Incorrect.


28 Q. You told them, “When we go to Neverland, we 6682


1 are always around people,” right?


2 A. Incorrect.


3 Q. You said, “Sometimes I stay in the visitors’


4 quarters, but mostly I am in the main house,” right?


5 A. Incorrect.


6 Q. You said, “Gavin, Star and Davellin have all


7 been in Michael’s room,” right?


8 A. Yes, I did.


9 Q. You said, “Yes, Gavin and Star have been


10 with Michael on his bed watching T.V.,” right?


11 A. Incorrect.


12 Q. You told the social workers, “As to the


13 allegations that they share a bed, it is no”?


14 A. What?


15 Q. Did you tell that to the social workers?


16 A. Repeat that, please.


17 Q. The words are, “As to the allegations that


18 they share a bed, it is no.”


19 A. Incorrect. These social workers, all they


20 were interested was not being sued by Michael


21 Jackson.


22 MR. ZONEN: Objection; nonresponsive.


23 THE COURT: Sustained.


24 THE WITNESS: They didn’t have —


25 THE COURT: Just a minute. There’s no


26 question pending.


27 THE WITNESS: Okay. Okay.


28 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: In that interview with the 6683


1 social workers, you said, “There are always children


2 in Michael’s room,” right?


3 A. Incorrect.


4 Q. You told the social workers, “On or about


5 September 15th, 2002, the day in question, Gavin and


6 Star were in Michael’s room watching T.V. and they


7 made s’mores in a fireplace in Michael’s room”?


8 A. Incorrect.


9 Q. Never said anything like that to the social


10 workers?


11 A. No, no. They didn’t even have no pad or pen


12 with them when they were sitting at the kitchen


13 table.


14 Q. You told the Los Angeles social workers, all


15 three of them, that, “Michael slept on the floor


16 with blankets and a sleeping bag while Gavin and


17 Star slept in the bed,” right?


18 A. Incorrect.


19 Q. You told the social workers, “I’m usually up


20 walking around the house all night long,” right?


21 A. No.


22 Q. You told the social workers, “The room is


23 open and there are no doors to shut,” correct?


24 A. Incorrect.


25 Q. You told the social workers, “It makes me


26 sick that someone would accuse Michael of doing harm


27 to my son and other children when he has never been


28 anything but wonderful.” 6684


1 You said that, didn’t you?


2 A. Incorrect.


3 Q. You told the social workers, “He has been


4 like a father to them,” right?


5 A. Yes.


6 Q. Told the social workers, “My children have


7 never felt uncomfortable in his presence,” right?


8 A. Incorrect.


9 Q. You told the social workers, “Michael has


10 been a blessing,” right?


11 A. Huh-uh.


12 Q. You told the social workers, “I was not


13 aware that the taping with Mr. Bashir would be


14 aired”?


15 A. That I did.


16 Q. You told them, “We did not sign any consent


17 to have my children on this interview,” right?


18 A. This is correct.

19 Q. You further told them, “When my children


20 would go to visit Neverland, there was always


21 somebody present,” right?


22 A. Incorrect.


23 Q. You told them, “On several occasions,


24 Michael’s friend, Chris Tucker, and his family were


25 there,” right?


26 A. I informed them that my children had been


27 there, had had that visit that I’ve already


28 expressed to you over and over. 6685


1 Q. You told the social workers, “In September


2 of 2002, Chris Tucker accompanied Gavin, Star and


3 Davellin in Neverland Ranch,” right?


4 A. That’s the birthday party that I was talking


5 to you about.


6 Q. You told them, “Our last visit to Neverland


7 together was on February 19th, 2003”; is that right?


8 A. Incorrect.


9 Q. You said, “The children are welcome there


10 any time,” right?


11 A. Incorrect.


12 Q. You said, “I do not always go to Neverland


13 with the children,” right?


14 A. This is correct.


15 Q. You told them, “Michael is like a father to


16 my children,” right?


17 A. This is correct.


18 Q. You said, “He’s like family,” correct?


19 A. This is correct.


20 Q. You said, “He gives advice to my children,


21 and that is something they never had with their


22 father,” right?


23 A. That is correct, because of the initial


24 meeting.


25 Q. You said, “He loves them and I trust them


26 with him,” right?


27 A. Yes. What a fool I was.


28 Q. You said, “Michael is so kind and I feel 6686


1 that he is misunderstood,” right?


2 A. “So kind,” but I didn’t say “misunderstood.”


3 Q. You further said, “Michael was an important


4 part of Gavin’s recovery from cancer,” right?


5 A. Incorrect.


6 Q. You said, “Gavin met Jamie Masada at The


7 Laugh Factory about three years ago and made a wish


8 to meet Michael Jackson,” true?


9 A. No. I said Gavin had spoke to Jamie and


10 said he was one of three people that he wanted to


11 meet.


12 Q. Did you tell them you felt that the paternal


13 grandparents had deserted your children?


14 A. Does that mean like David’s family? I’m


15 asking you if that’s what it means. Unless you want


16 to clear — can you make it clearer, please?


17 Q. All I can ask you is, did you say, “Mother


18 feels that the paternal grandparents have deserted


19 the children”?


20 A. Oh.


21 MR. ZONEN: I’ll object as vague.


22 THE COURT: She’s asked for a definition of


23 “paternal.”




25 THE COURT: She didn’t use the word. It’s


26 not suggested she used the word. That’s a


27 conclusion of one of the social workers. So would


28 you help her? 6687


1 MR. MESEREAU: Yes, I will, Your Honor.


2 Q. Yes, I think the way you’ve defined it would


3 be correct.


4 A. Yes. Yes. David’s family didn’t want


5 nothing to do with my kids.


6 Q. Do you remember telling those social workers


7 the media has been taking everything out of context


8 and you’re appalled at the negative attention your


9 children have been receiving?


10 A. No. What I told her is that — told them


11 that I didn’t understand what was happening.


12 Q. Did you tell them that you’ve been having a


13 difficult time personally and financially?


14 A. No.


15 Q. You told them about your prior involvement


16 with the DCFS, right?


17 A. Oh, yes. Yes, I did.


18 Q. Your children were interviewed on that day,


19 right?


20 A. Yes.


21 Q. Were you there when they were interviewed?


22 A. Yes, I was.


23 Q. And just in summary, you heard them say


24 glowing things about Michael Jackson, right?


25 A. Yes, they did. Yes.

Next, Janet was asked to describe to the jury exactly when and how she found out that the DCFS investigation was closed, and she stated that when she complained to Karen Walker (the supervisor of the three social workers) that she was being held hostage at Neverland, and that Gavin had been plied with alcohol, Walker told her that it’s “out of her hands”.

26 Q. And at some point, you learned that this


27 investigation was closed, right?


28 A. Yes, I came to find out. 6688


1 Q. Approximately when did you find out the


2 investigation was closed?


3 A. Well, when Jay and me paged Karen Walker


4 after the Family Court day and we asked her for


5 help. And she said, “It’s out of my hands. It’s


6 out of my hands. We’ve already done the report. Go


7 get legal help. I can’t help you.”


8 When I told her that my son had been given


9 alcohol, that we were being held, that they were


10 taped, gave her all this information, and she said,


11 “It’s out of my hands,” that’s when I found out the


12 report was done.


13 Q. And approximately what date was that?


14 A. That was the 11th, March 11th.


15 Q. And did you call her?


16 A. Yes, I did.


17 Q. Okay. Did you file a report?


18 A. Well, I spoke to the supervisor. She was


19 the supervisor, Karen Walker.

Next, Janet was questioned again about her relationship with attorney William Dickerman. He did not include anything about alcohol, molestation, or imprisonment at Neverland in any of his letters to Mark Geragos, which were written to facilitate getting Janet’s furniture returned to her from storage. Dickerman represented Janet until he “kicked her to the curb” for refusing to tell him information that she was giving to police, which she claimed she was told by police not to tell to anyone because it would compromise their investigation. Mesereau immediately challenged the logic behind this, because Janet didn’t talk to police until almost two months after meeting with Dickerman!

20 Q. Were you being represented by Attorney


21 William Dickerman at that point?


22 A. No.


23 Q. When did you first start being represented


24 by Attorney William Dickerman?


25 A. After she didn’t help me.


26 Q. He didn’t write to the DCFS at any time, did


27 he?


28 A. No, he didn’t. But Mr. Feldman did. 6689


1 Q. And that was, what, months later? To your


2 knowledge.


3 A. I can’t….


4 Q. Okay. Did you ever read any of the letters


5 Attorney Dickerman was sending to Attorney Mark


6 Geragos?


7 A. Yes, some of them I did.


8 Q. And did you assist Mr. Dickerman in


9 preparing those letters?


10 A. I didn’t assist him. I told him what was


11 happening. He wrote them himself.


12 Q. And was it your belief that Mr. Dickerman


13 was writing Mr. Geragos to complain about injustices


14 that had been done to you and your family?


15 A. What Mr. Dickerman was doing was giving us


16 help, as retrieving our visa, our passports,


17 everything that belonged to us. Where is my


18 storage? Where is my items? Things that belonged


19 to me. Requesting that my children’s clothing be


20 returned.


21 Because when Frank rummaged through the


22 children’s clothing, he took all the new clothing


23 that they had purchased. But when they were doing


24 that, they also took my children’s own clothing and


25 kept all of Gavin’s clothing. And Frank said that


26 if they wanted them, they needed to come back to


27 Neverland.


28 Just different things like that. And for 6690


1 your people to stop following us, and to make you


2 aware that we wanted nothing to do with you anymore.


3 Q. In none of his letters did he ever mention


4 anything about alcohol or child molestation, true?


5 A. Because that was information for these guys


6 right here, for the police.


7 Q. How many months later?


8 A. Because I didn’t want Geragos to know that


9 we were headed towards — straight to the police.


10 Q. Do you know when you first met with


11 Dickerman?


12 A. I believe — I think it was the 25th of


13 February.


14 Q. Pardon me?


15 A. I believe I met him, but he was not my


16 attorney, February 25th. Just met him for minutes.


17 Minutes. That’s it.

18 Q. How many meetings did you have with Mr.


19 Dickerman?


20 A. Prior to leaving out of Neverland, once.


21 Q. How about after you left Neverland?


22 A. After I left Neverland? Well, all these —


23 in order to — I think — the best I can believe, I


24 think it was two. It was two. That’s the best I


25 can remember.


26 Q. How long did Mr. Dickerman represent you?


27 A. Well, until Mr. Feldman and Mr. Dickerman


28 kicked me to the curb because I didn’t want to tell 6691


1 them all the information that I was telling the


2 police. Because the police told me not to tell them


3 because that would compromise the investigation.


4 And so I didn’t tell them nothing. Mr. Feldman was


5 clueless, and so was Mr. Dickerman.


6 Q. But you weren’t speaking to the police until


7 long after you met Larry Feldman, true?


8 A. Yes, because I wanted to ensure that these


9 people weren’t following us anymore.


10 Q. You didn’t go to the police until months


11 after you first started meeting with Attorney Larry


12 Feldman?


13 A. This is correct. I wanted to just


14 hopefully — maybe we could have the ability to


15 just — maybe it would disappear. But the more


16 things were happening, the more I was becoming


17 aware.


18 Q. So you had gone to at least two lawyers


19 about your alleged problems with Mr. Jackson for


20 months before you ever spoke to anyone with the


21 Santa Barbara Sheriff’s Department, right, Ms.


22 Arvizo?


23 A. Yes, this is correct.

When asked by Mesereu to confirm that the first allegations of child molestation came from Mr. Feldman, Janet gave yet another convoluted answer that made absolutely no sense whatsoever:

24 Q. And the first report of any allegation of


25 child molestation to the sheriffs came from Mr.


26 Feldman, did it not?


27 A. Let me see. Well, actually — actually,


28 Mr. — my husband, Jay Jackson, tried to reach the 6692


1 police. And then when me and — me and Jay both


2 contacted the supervisor, Karen Walker, then — and


3 she said to go get legal help. And also, as things


4 are moving in dates, I’m starting to find out more


5 and more. Now I know why he had a criminal defense


6 attorney, but I didn’t know because there was no


7 investigation underway.


8 Q. There had been an investigation since


9 February that was publicly announced by Santa


10 Barbara, right?


11 A. Well, I wasn’t aware of that.


12 Q. You’re claiming that in the middle of all of


13 these efforts to falsely imprison your family,


14 restrain your family, get you to Brazil, deal with


15 the media, all of a sudden child molestation starts,


16 right?


17 MR. ZONEN: Objection. Argumentative and


18 compound.


19 THE COURT: Sustained on compound.

Once more, Janet denied making several exculpatory statements about Jackson to the DCFS workers, including trying to reach Jackson in order to help her get tutors for her children during the time of their imprisonment:

20 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Do you remember meeting


21 with someone named “Bowen” from the DCFS?


22 A. No. Is she the one, or he, that leaked all


23 the information from the DCFS to everybody?


24 Q. You remember meeting with three women from


25 the DCFS on the 20th, right?


26 A. Yes, I do.


27 Q. And there was Karen Walker, right?


28 A. Yes. 6693


1 Q. Was there — Irene Peters one of the ladies?


2 A. That sounds familiar.


3 Q. How about Jacqueline Bowen?


4 A. I don’t — I don’t remember the — all I


5 remember is Miss Karen Walker, Jackie and someone


6 named Yvonne. So I don’t know.


7 Q. And you complained to Miss Peters about the


8 Bashir documentary, right?


9 A. No, I didn’t. I told them that there was no


10 consent. That’s all.


11 Q. And you were upset about that, right?


12 A. No, I said there was no consent.


13 Q. Do you remember complaining that you could


14 not get any assistance from Michael Jackson


15 regarding tutoring or home schooling because of all


16 the media attention?


17 A. No. That’s incorrect.


18 Q. Do you remember saying you were having a


19 difficult time schooling your kids because of the


20 media attention?


21 A. That’s incorrect. Because I reenrolled my


22 children back into that school the second we finally


23 got to leave Neverland permanently.


24 Q. Do you remember telling Miss Bowen you were


25 having a hard time contacting Michael Jackson in


26 regards to helping with the tutoring due to the


27 problems the children were having at school?


28 A. That’s incorrect. 6694


1 Q. You never said that to Ms. Bowen of the




3 A. No, the meeting was so small with them, that


4 I remember all they were interested was not being


5 sued by Michael Jackson.


6 Q. And how long was that meeting, if you


7 remember?


8 A. Okay. Well, let me see. Here we go.


9 Twenty minutes — about 20 minutes of Asaf taping


10 it. So about maybe after that, maybe about ten


11 minutes sitting with them. 10, 15 minutes. 15


12 minutes would be generous. So about a total of —


13 altogether maybe 30, 35 minutes, 40 minutes. 40


14 minutes would be a stretch. That would be making it


15 generous.


16 They came in there for one thing only. You


17 know, one thing: Not to be sued by Michael Jackson.


18 MR. ZONEN: I’ll object as nonresponsive.


19 THE COURT: The last two sentences are


20 stricken.


21 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Do you remember asking


22 Karen Walker if she could talk to Michael’s people


23 to see if they could provide schooling for your


24 kids?


25 A. No.


26 Q. Do you remember asking Miss Walker if she


27 would write a letter on your behalf so your kids


28 could get schooling? 6695


1 A. No.


2 Q. And do you remember telling Ms. Walker


3 you’re not going to take a trip to Brazil?


4 A. Do I?


5 Q. Yes.


6 A. I made no mention to them of leaving the


7 country. I made her aware afterwards, when Jay and


8 I paged her, what they were trying to do.


9 Q. Now, at some point, did you sign any


10 documents which suggested your children should be


11 taken out of their school?


12 A. I — not suggested. It was. I didn’t sign


13 the one for Davellin, which they had done before


14 they had taken the children out. The one for the


15 boys I did sign, because that was afterwards.


16 Q. And the document you signed was designed to


17 give your permission to take your sons out of


18 school, correct?


19 A. This is correct.


20 Q. And what school did you think they were


21 leaving?


22 A. I didn’t know. I just did what they said.


23 That’s it. At that point, the end point, I was


24 doing what they were saying. That’s it.


25 MR. ZONEN: Objection; nonresponsive to the


26 question.


27 THE COURT: I’ll strike after, “I didn’t


28 know.” 6696


1 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: During the point in time


2 when you signed that document authorizing your sons


3 to be taken out of school, did you talk to anyone at


4 the school?


5 A. At that time, no. I wasn’t even present.


6 Q. But clearly you knew your children were


7 going to be leaving their school, right?


8 A. This is correct.


9 Q. And what school did you believe Gavin was


10 leaving?


11 A. They were going to be nowhere. We were


12 headed out — out of the country. This was for


13 their purpose of no one being able to trace my


14 children nor me. We were headed out.


15 Q. What school did you believe Gavin was


16 leaving when you signed that document?


17 A. Well, if it was up to them, they were going


18 to be in no school.


19 MR. ZONEN: Your Honor, I don’t believe the

20 witness understands the question.


21 MR. MESEREAU: I can try to rephrase it,


22 Your Honor, if it’s unclear.


23 THE COURT: We’ll just have the court


24 reporter read it back. She hasn’t said she doesn’t


25 understand.


26 Read it back.


27 (Record read.)


28 THE WITNESS: Zero. 6697


1 MR. ZONEN: I don’t believe the witness


2 understands the question.


3 THE WITNESS: I don’t understand.


4 MR. MESEREAU: I’ll try to rephrase it.


5 Q. You signed a document —


6 A. Yes.


7 Q. — authorizing the school to release Gavin


8 as a student, right?


9 A. Gavin and Star. The boys.


10 Q. Which school were you talking about?


11 A. That they were attending?


12 Q. Yes.


13 A. They were attending John Burroughs.


14 Q. And you knew that a document was prepared to


15 allow Davellin to leave school, right?


16 A. No.


17 Q. Did you know that Davellin was going to


18 leave school?


19 A. No. Davellin, I had no knowledge of.


20 Q. So you thought you were going to Brazil, but


21 you only thought Gavin and Star were leaving school?


22 A. No, no. I signed that paper because they


23 had me sign it.


24 Q. To your knowledge, did Gavin and Star


25 actually leave that school?


26 A. Well, they were checked out by Vinnie. I


27 wasn’t there. When I finally got permanently out of


28 Neverland, I reenrolled them immediately into the 6698


1 same school.

Mesereau questioned Janet about the final time that she and her family left Neverland; she stated that she left because Jackson gave Gavin alcohol. Furthermore, Janet testified that she didn’t know that Jay Jackson demanded money from Frank Cascio as compensation for their participation in the rebuttal video:

2 Q. Well, when you got out of Neverland at that


3 point, you knew you were not going to be involved


4 with Mr. Jackson ever again, correct?


5 A. He gave my son alcohol. Please.


6 Q. Did you know that?


7 A. He gave my son alcohol. That was enough for


8 me. But as time progressed, I found out more and


9 more and more. So no way, no way.


10 Q. Well, as time went on, the story just kept


11 getting bigger and bigger, didn’t it?


12 MR. ZONEN: Objection. Argumentative;


13 asked and answered.


14 THE COURT: It’s argumentative. Sustained.


15 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Did you know that Major


16 Jay Jackson had asked for monetary compensation for


17 your family from Frank?


18 A. No.


19 Q. Did you know that Jay Jackson had said words


20 to the effect, “You guys are making millions. And


21 this family should get their proper piece of the


22 action”?


23 MR. ZONEN: Objection; misstatement of the


24 evidence.


25 THE COURT: Overruled.


26 You may answer.


27 THE WITNESS: Okay. I’ve come to find out


28 now. But, no, I didn’t then. 6699


1 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: So at that point in time,


2 you never discussed with Major Jay Jackson your


3 family’s right to have any compensation if they


4 appeared in a rebuttal video?


5 A. This is correct. There was a new


6 relationship with Jay.


7 Q. And based on the fact that you now are aware


8 of this, do you believe he kept you silent on that


9 issue?


10 A. I don’t understand your question.


11 Q. You’re saying that Jay Jackson never told


12 you that he approached Frank and said, “How much is


13 the family going to get?”


14 A. I’m aware now, because of the


15 investigations, but I didn’t know then. And that’s


16 it.


17 Q. Did you know at any time that Major Jackson


18 was discussing the possibility of selling a story to


19 a British tabloid?


20 A. I think you’re saying it incorrect. I


21 barely found out as I’ve been up here.


22 But the way he’s saying it isn’t the way


23 it’s been said to me by the D.A.’s Office.


24 Q. Did you know at any time that Major Jackson


25 was in discussions with representatives of a British


26 tabloid about the possibility of selling a story?


27 A. No.


28 Q. He never discussed that with you at any 6700


1 time?


2 A. No. Not at all. Till this day he still


3 hasn’t.


4 Q. Did you ever have a discussion with Frank


5 about your getting any home in the Hollywood Hills?


6 A. No.


7 Q. Did you ever have a discussion with Frank


8 about the possibility of a college education for


9 Gavin being paid for by Michael Jackson?


10 A. No.

Janet believed that her signature was forged on the lawsuit documents by “the Germans”:

11 Q. Now, you believe your signature was forged


12 on some documents making you a party to a lawsuit in


13 Britain, right?


14 A. My signature, per their investigation, is


15 accurate. I signed a blank piece of paper in Miami


16 that Ronald had presented to me. But that signature


17 is mine.


18 Q. Did you ever receive any communications from


19 any lawyer regarding the lawsuit in England?


20 A. After we were permanently out, Mr. Dickerman


21 communicated to me that this was going on. And they


22 even offered me money to stay in it, and I said no.

Janet next testified that she thought that she being “forced” to leave the country, and she denied telling a Neverland employee named Katie Bernard that Jackson was a great guy. And, once again, just to clarify it to the jury, Janet corrected Mesereau’s assertion that she had a spa treatment by saying she “only” had a leg wax.

Mesereau continued to question Janet about other Neverland employees who drove her to various places, and she denied all of it, and made sure that she also included the fact that she was forced to miss Ash Wednesday services at church (she was obviously trying to play the “religion” card to gain the juror’s sympathy).

23 Q. When you left the apartment on Soto Street,


24 did you personally sign any documents that say


25 you’re going to leave?


26 A. No.


27 Q. Did you ever sign any documents involving


28 rent that was owed or not owed? 6701


1 A. No, I did not.


2 Q. Did you ever talk to the landlord and say


3 you were leaving?


4 A. Yes, I did.


5 Q. And was that Yolanda?


6 A. Yes.


7 Q. Okay.


8 A. And I — this is another person that I tried


9 to slip something in —


10 MR. MESEREAU: Move to strike.


11 THE WITNESS: — leaving — that I told her


12 I was leaving the country.


13 THE COURT: Just a moment. Just a moment,


14 please.


15 Stricken.


16 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Was that Yolanda Lazalde?


17 A. Yes. That’s where I slipped in “I’m leaving


18 the country.” This is another one of the people


19 that I was trying to reach out to.


20 Q. This was another one of your clues that you


21 were leaving?


22 A. Pardon me? Yes. Yes, it was.


23 Q. Now, was Ramon Trujillo also the landlord?


24 A. Yes.


25 Q. Okay. Did you communicate with Ramon


26 Trujillo that you were leaving the apartment?


27 A. No, I had no communication with him.


28 Q. Okay. You told Miss Lazalde that you were 6702


1 leaving the apartment, but gave no reason?


2 A. I did not tell her that. I told her I was


3 leaving the country, but that’s it. Jay Jackson had


4 went and paid my current rent.


5 Q. To your knowledge, did anyone other than Jay


6 Jackson pay rent that you owed?


7 A. No. It was from my funds that he went and


8 did me the favor to go pay the rent, because I


9 couldn’t.


10 Q. My question is, and it may not have been


11 clear, are you aware of anyone other than Jay


12 Jackson paying rent that you owed on that apartment?


13 A. I came to find out, through that, what Mr.


14 Zonen submitted into evidence, that they had done


15 that. And then I also came to find out that Frank


16 and Vinnie had said that this was a way for no one


17 to start searching for where me and the kids might


18 be.

19 Q. Now, at this point in time, you thought that


20 Mr. Jackson, one of the best known people in the


21 world, was trying to just kidnap your whole family,


22 right?


23 MR. ZONEN: Object as argumentative.


24 THE COURT: Sustained.


25 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: At this point in time, you


26 thought Michael Jackson was arranging to kidnap your


27 entire family, right?


28 MR. ZONEN: Objection to the use of 6703


1 “kidnap”; leading.


2 THE COURT: Overruled.


3 You may answer.


4 THE WITNESS: All I know is what I saw and


5 what I knew. They were making me, my children leave


6 the country. That’s all I knew.


7 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: You were leaving the


8 country for one week, right?


9 A. No. Till they decided when. And as long as


10 I did what they told me.


11 Q. Do you know someone named Katie Bernard who


12 worked at Neverland?


13 A. No.


14 Q. Now, are you aware of Katie Bernard driving


15 you to the spa in Los Olivos when you had the wax?


16 A. That was Chris Carter.


17 Q. You don’t recall Katie Bernard doing that?


18 A. No, it was Chris.


19 Q. Are you aware of a Katie Bernard ever


20 dropping you off the next day to have your hair


21 done?


22 A. Never happened.


23 Q. Do you remember telling Katie Bernard how


24 good Michael Jackson had been to your family and


25 what a great guy he was?


26 A. No, I don’t even know Katie Bernard.


27 Q. Okay. Are you aware of Katie Bernard paying


28 for your spa treatment? 6704


1 A. No. And it was a leg wax.


2 Q. Did you ever call Katie Bernard and ask her


3 to arrange for Gavin and Star’s braces to be removed


4 by a dentist?


5 A. No. That was taken care of by Frank and


6 Vinnie.


7 Q. Did you ever tell Katie Bernard that you


8 were being hassled by a Los Angeles dentist for


9 payment and you wanted her to arrange to have your


10 two sons’ braces removed?


11 A. No.


12 Q. Did you ever tell Katie Bernard you wanted


13 her to return the braces to the L.A. dentist because


14 you couldn’t afford to pay for them?


15 A. No.


16 Q. Do you remember ever calling Katie Bernard


17 and saying you wanted to go shopping for clothes


18 while you were at Neverland?


19 A. No.


20 Q. Did you ever know someone at Neverland named


21 Rafael Camacho?


22 A. No.


23 Q. Do you recall Rafael Camacho occasionally


24 driving you to places off the ranch property while


25 you were staying at Neverland?


26 MR. ZONEN: I’ll object as lack of


27 familiarity by the witness. She says no, she


28 doesn’t know him. 6705


1 THE COURT: Sustained.


2 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Do you know whether or not


3 anyone who worked at Neverland ever drove you to


4 various places off the ranch property while you


5 stayed at Neverland?


6 A. No. They even made me miss Ash Wednesday,


7 and I had never missed it before.


8 Q. Who’s “they”?


9 A. Michael’s people.


10 Q. Okay. Did you ask for someone to drive you


11 to church on Ash Wednesday?


12 A. They knew I wanted to go to church. But at


13 that point, that was it.


14 Q. But did you actually ask for someone to


15 drive you to a local church on Ash Wednesday?


16 A. Yes, I did.


17 Q. Who did you ask?


18 A. I asked Frank and I asked Vinnie, and they


19 said no.

In this excerpt, Mesereau just goes through a laundry list of Neverland employees to see if Janet has any recollection of any interactions with them, but of course she denied them all, as usual:

20 Q. Did you ever know someone named Modesto


21 Camarena at Neverland?


22 A. No.


23 Q. Did you ever know someone at Neverland named


24 Hector Elenes?


25 A. No.


26 Q. Did you know someone at Neverland named


27 Francisco Fuentes?


28 A. No. 6706


1 Q. Ever complain to Francisco Fuentes that you


2 were struggling financially?


3 A. I don’t even know Francisco Fuentes.


4 MR. ZONEN: I’ll so object as lack of


5 foundation.


6 THE COURT: Lack of foundation; sustained.


7 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Ever know someone at


8 Neverland named Tammy Gewehr, G-e-w-e-h-r?


9 A. No.


10 Q. Ever know someone at Neverland named Gayle


11 Goforth?


12 A. No.


13 Q. Ever know someone who worked at Neverland


14 named Maria Gomez?


15 A. No.


16 Q. Ever tell Maria Gomez that you thought Frank


17 and Vinnie were separating you from Michael Jackson?


18 MR. ZONEN: Objection. Lack of foundation,


19 that she knows this person.


20 THE COURT: Sustained.


21 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Did you ever tell anyone


22 at Neverland that Frank and Vinnie were separating


23 you from Michael Jackson?


24 A. No.


25 Q. Did you ever tell anyone at Neverland that


26 you had financial problems?


27 A. No.


28 Q. Did you ever know someone who worked at 6707


1 Neverland named Curtis Gordon?


2 A. No.


3 Q. Did you ever know someone at Neverland named


4 Patty Hankins?


5 A. No.


6 Q. How about Chris Hernandez?


7 A. No.


8 Q. How about Ryan Hester?


9 A. No.


10 Q. Ever know someone who worked at Neverland


11 named Anthony Hudley?


12 A. No.


13 Q. Did you ever know someone who worked at


14 Neverland named Charlie Kirchhoff?


15 A. No.


16 Q. Ever know someone who worked at Neverland


17 named Julio Magana?


18 A. No, I don’t. But I remember when I had


19 called to Neverland to make contact with my kids,


20 because I was already out, I asked him his name and


21 he said his name was Julio. So that was it. But


22 that’s the name. It sounds familiar.


23 Q. Do you know someone who worked at Neverland


24 named Christy Mann?


25 A. No.


26 Q. Did you ever know someone named Shane


27 Meredith?


28 A. No. 6708


1 Q. During any of your trips to Neverland, did


2 you ever meet someone named Samuel Moreno?


3 A. No.


4 Q. Did you ever meet someone named Jonathan


5 Bruce Richards?


6 A. No.


7 Q. Did you ever meet someone named Manuel


8 Rivera during your trips to Neverland?


9 A. No.


10 Q. During your trips to Neverland, did you ever


11 compliment Michael Jackson?


12 A. No.


13 Q. Ever complain to anyone that you wanted your


14 children on television with Michael Jackson?


15 A. No.


16 Q. Now, you did argue with Ronald Konitzer at


17 Neverland, right?


18 A. I didn’t argue with him.


19 Q. Did you ever argue with Dieter?


20 A. I didn’t argue with them.


21 Q. Did you ever know someone at Neverland named

22 Brian Salce, S-a-l-c-e?


23 A. No.


24 Q. Ever know an employee at Neverland named


25 James Silva?


26 A. No.


27 Q. While you were visiting Neverland, did you


28 ever meet Javier Velasco? 6709


1 A. No.


2 Q. Did you ever tell anyone at Neverland that


3 your children loved Michael Jackson like a father?


4 A. No. Once at Neverland, all that stopped.


5 Especially when he’s running around like crazy with


6 my kids.


7 Q. Did you ever complain to Javier Velasco that


8 Michael Jackson had promised to take care of you,


9 and you knew now it wasn’t going to happen?


10 MR. ZONEN: Lack of foundation that she ever


11 knew Javier Velasco.


12 THE COURT: Sustained.


13 Q. BY MR. MESEREAU: Did you ever complain to


14 anyone at Neverland that Michael Jackson had


15 promised to take care of you, and now you knew it


16 wasn’t going to happen?


17 A. No.


18 Q. Ever meet someone named Angel Vivanco?


19 A. No.


20 Q. Did you ever know someone named Jason


21 Wolcott at Neverland?


22 A. No.

Next, Mesereau pivoted back to the rebuttal video, and questioned Janet about the script that she claimed was written by Christian Robinson:

23 Q. Did you ever meet someone named Christian


24 Robinson?


25 A. Yes. He’s the one that did the — the


26 rebuttal video. He’s the one that had the scripted


27 questions and you could even see him holding it.


28 And he’s the one that also picked up mine and my 6710


1 children’s birth certificate.


2 Q. Now, when you say “scripted questions,” do


3 you mean he had the questions in advance that he was


4 going to ask you on the rebuttal video?


5 A. Yes. That’s my understanding. I may be


6 wrong.


7 Q. And were they the questions you believe he


8 was asking you when you filmed the rebuttal video?


9 A. Yes.


10 Q. Where did you first meet him?


11 A. Right there.


12 Q. Was that at Hamid’s house?


13 A. Yes.


14 Q. Was that the first time you had ever seen


15 him?


16 A. Yes.


17 Q. And that would have been the — what, the


18 day of the 20th?


19 A. The day of the 19th, going into the 20th.


20 From 19th, about 11-something, till like a.m. hours


21 of the 20th.


22 Q. And approximately what time do you think you


23 met Christian Robinson?


24 A. Oh, well, when I got there.


25 Q. Now, did someone tell you whose house you


26 were going to?


27 A. Yes. Vinnie.


28 Q. Okay. So you knew it was owned by someone 6711


1 named Hamid, right?


2 A. Yes. And also Frank on the phone.


3 Q. Your understanding was that the purpose of


4 that video was to make Michael Jackson look good,


5 right?


6 A. That’s correct.


7 Q. And you knew for quite a while that efforts


8 were being made to put together a television show in


9 response to the Bashir documentary, right?


10 A. That’s what I came to find out. And I


11 wanted no part of it, and that’s why I left with


12 Jesus, me and my children.


13 Q. Did you ever hear your sons say to Mr.


14 Robinson they wanted to be famous on the T.V. show?


15 A. I don’t think so.


16 Q. When is the last time you saw Christian


17 Robinson?


18 A. It was just that day. That’s it.

To be continued:

2 Comments leave one →
  1. stacey2 permalink
    July 17, 2013 6:50 pm

    Did the prosecution really think they had a chance of winning? You can’t have witnesses lie so compulsively under oath and then expect a jury to convict a defendant on all counts. What kind of justice system would that be?


  1. April 18th, 2005 Trial Analysis: Janet Arvizo (Cross-Examination), Part 2 of 4 | Michael Jackson Vindication 2.0

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