May 5th, 2005 Trial Analysis: Wade Robson and Brett Barnes, Part 4 of 4
The next defense witness was Jackson’s former friend Wade Robson. He testified on Jackson’s behalf and vehemently denied being abused by the superstar, and his testimony was instrumental in Jackson’s acquittal. However, on May 1st, 2013 Robson filed a lawsuit against the Estate of Michael Jackson, recanting his 2005 testimony and claiming to have been sexually abused by Jackson.
A summary and analysis of Robson’s testimony can be found in this post, and I have also refuted and debunked his outrageous claims. As of this writing, Robson and his attorneys are still seeking their day in court, and the Estate of Michael Jackson is vigorously trying to have his frivolous lawsuit dismissed. For more information, you can follow updates on this website: http://www.dailymichael.com/
The next defense witness was Brett Barnes, another alleged “victim” of Jackson, according to prosecution witnesses Adrian McManus and Ralph Chacon, who both testified earlier in the trial. This is an excerpt of Sneddon’s description of what Chacon claimed to have seen in 1993 (which is from the PLAINTIFF’S MOTION FOR ADMISSION OF EVIDENCE OF DEFENDANT’S PRIOR SEXUAL OFFENSES):
During most of 1992 and during the time of the incidents set forth in this offer of proof, Mr. Chacon worked the graveyard shift from 10:00 p.m. to 6:00 a.m. at Neverland Valley Ranch. He recalled an unusual incident in 1992, which he believes occurred in the spring because the weather was nice. At the time, Chacon was engaged in putting away the golf carts. He believes he started this project between 10:30 and 11:00 p.m.
Chacon heard the back door to the main residence slam. Chacon noticed Jackson and another young boy corning out of the house in swimming trunks. They went to the Jacuzzi located near the swimming pool. He was aware that there was another security officer in that area, so he continued putting away the golf carts.
About the time Chacon finished securing the golf carts for the night, he heard Michael Jackson yelling in a high-pitched voice, “Security, security.” As he started in that direction, he saw Sgt. Kassim Abdool in the area so he returned to finishing the cart project. After a while he saw the cook, Bucky Black, coming out of the house carrying a tray. Later, when Sgt. Abdool left the area to do some mobile patrolling, Chacon took up Abdool’s post near the barbecue area behind the house. He heard but could not see Michael Jackson and the boy inside the Jacuzzi. After a while Jackson and the boy got out of the Jacuzzi and walked towards the back bathrooms in the recreation room which is located near the video arcade. There are two bathrooms, one for females and one for males. They entered the “males” bathroom and closed the door. About this time Bucky Black exited the residence and left the property.
About half an hour after Jackson and the boy entered the bathroom, Chacon became curious. Chacon went to the left side of the recreation building where the tennis courts are located. He walked down the sidewalk to the back of the bathrooms. The “males” bathroom and the “females” bathroom each have a window. As he approached the area, he could hear Jackson and the boy, and he could hear the shower. Looking inside through the window Chacon saw only one shower. From the sound he could tell Jackson and the young boy were in the shower together, but he could not see them because the curtain was pulled closed.
Chacon then started to return to his previous location, but about half way down the path he decided to go back. He got to the window and inched closer. By this time Michael Jackson and the young boy were out of the shower and had moved to a larger, open area near the wash basins. They were now standing near the area where robes and towels are kept. They were facing each other. Both were naked. Michael Jackson was fondling the boy. He could see Michael Jackson bending over and kissing all over the boy’s face and mouth. By ‘fondling,” Chacon described Michael Jackson’s hands moving all over the child’s body, as a nan would passionately caress a woman.
Michael Jackson was taller than the boy. Jackson was bending over and started to go down in front of the boy, kissing the child all the way down to his stomach. Jackson then took the boy’s penis and put it into his mouth. Chacon actually saw Jackson put the child’s penis into his mouth and that’s when he took off. Approximately ten to twenty seconds lapsed from the time he first saw Michael Jackson kissing and fondling the child until the time that he saw him place the child’s penis in his mouth. The kissing was continuous until Jackson put the child’s penis in his mouth.
The bathroom area where Chacon saw Jackson and the boy was well lit. There are lights in the bathroom area and additional lights where the towels were located, as well as over by the wash basins. The showers have lighting as well. The outside lighting was very minimal, where was only a small sidewalk light to help guide persons walking in the area.
After about an hour, Chacon heard the bathroom door open. Jackson and the boy exited the room and the boy was mounted on Michael’s shoulders. The boy had on a white robe, but his legs were dangling around Michael’s neck. Chacon could see the boy was naked underneath. Jackson had a towel wrapped around his waist.
Chacon recognized the boy as a child who spent a lot of time at the ranch. He described the child’s height as coming up to approximately Jackson’s chin. He had dark, long and straight hair. His skin tone was tanned like Chacon’s. The boy’s parents were not at the ranch at the time that this incident occurred. There were no other children at the ranch on this occasion. He believes this child was a boy named “Jordy,” but there was another kid from Australia whose name was Brett Barnes. Barnes was the spitting image of Jordy and sometimes it was hard for Chacon to tell who was Jordy and who was Brett, although Jordy was a little bit taller than Brett.
In another incident, closely related in time, both the Barnes family from Australia and Jordy were at the ranch. Two or more boys were in the video arcade playing games. Chacon was by the pool walking around when he saw Michael Jackson come out of the house and walk to the back door of the arcade, which is located between the bathrooms. While standing by the slide in the pool area, Chacon had a really good view into the video room. It vas at night, but the arcade’s interior was well lit. He could see everything going on inside.
Here’s Sneddon’s summary of what Adrian McManus claimed to have seen:
On a later date, after she was assigned to clean Michael Jackson’s room but before his 1993 “Dangerous” tour, she saw another incident involving a young boy by the name of Brett Barnes. She believes it was in 1993 and in the morning.
Mrs. McManus had been directed by Michael Jackson to go upstairs and pull out all the videotapes in a certain room. Jackson and the Barnes boy came to the video room to see how she was coming along with the chore. They left together and headed downstairs. She decided it was too hot in the room, so she also decided to go downstairs. When she got to the landing near the bottom of the stairway, she looked down the hallway leading to Jackson’s bedroom. Jackson and Barnes were side by side facing the door to the bedroom and Michael Jackson was on the boy’s right. She saw Michael Jackson kissing Brett Barnes and fondling his buttock area. Jackson’s left hand was over the boy’s clothing and on the child’s bottom.
Jackson was kissing the boy on the right side of the child’s face, near his mouth. She panicked and immediately retreated back to the videotapes project.
Mesereau rebutted them very succinctly in the SUPPLEMENTAL BRIEF IN SUPPORT OF OPPOSITON TO DISTRICT ATTORNEY’S MOTION FOR ADMISSION OF ALLEGED PRIOR OFFENSES:
The Abdool Plaintiffs
The defense requests that the Court take judicial notice of the file in Abdool v. Jackson, Santa Maria Superior Court, Case No. SM 89344. The plaintiffs in that case, including Adrian McManus and Ralph Chacon, who are listed as witnesses in the prosecution’s motion, and their lawyer, Michael Ring, were sanctioned jointly on numerous occasions for lying in their depositions and to the court.
The total sanctions were approximately $66,000. The sanctions were imposed for discovery violations and for forcing the defendants to prove, in open court, that the plaintiffs were lying. The sanctions were imposed because the plaintiffs had lied in their depositions and, in some instances, actually lied on the stand in open court. For instance, on one occasion, one of the plaintiffs, while on the stand, blatantly contradicted her own testimony, given earlier in the day. The judge left the bench saying he was disgusted.
The jury in the Abdool case found against the plaintiff on all of their allegations. The jury also found in favor of the defendant, Michael Jackson, and against Adrian McManus and Ralph Chacon, for stealing from Mr. Jackson. The court imposed attorney’s fees and costs of $1.4 million against the plaintiffs. The trial of these plaintiffs lasted 6 months and 1 day before The Honorable Judge Canter. Were these plaintiffs to be called in this case, one would assume, based on the six month duration of the Abdool trial, that the plaintiff’s testimony and the defense would take at least a month in and of itself.
Furthermore, these witnesses were not claiming to be percipient witnesses to actual sexual offenses, with the exception of Ralph Chacon.
Ralph Chacon is a liar. He lied about being given a weapons permit based on his role as a witness. He lied in deposition. He lied to reporters and he lied on the stand.
Adrian McManus had stolen from her own family members. She was sued for stealing niece and nephew’s inheritance. She made all sorts of false and contradictory claims.
The plaintiffs were allowed to talk about the allegations in pretrial discovery, and did so. The only person having anything salacious to say was Ralph Chacon. When the case came to trial, the trial court disallowed evidence of the salacious allegations because they had nothing to do with the causes of action in the litigation. Nevertheless, these plaintiffs were thoroughly discredited, not only as to the allegations they made in court, but as to what Mr. Chacon had to say.
With regard to all of the Abdool plaintiffs, they lied about going to the media and selling their stories, when in fact, they had an agent and had gone to the media to sell their stories. It turned out they were a bit too late to take advantage of the opportunities that Blanca Francia and the Quindoys were able to cash in on. These people tried to hawk their false stores and were unsuccessful, so they filed their meritless lawsuit. They lied about meeting with the media. As if this were not enough, the stories that they told and personally edited were so fantastic and salacious, they had denied ever saying such things, when they believed that Mr. Jackson’s counsel did not know about it. Even after the stories appeared, they denied that they had talked with the journalists, because they denied that the events in the stories occurred. In one instance, it was demonstrated that their handwritten notes were on drafts of the stories. Once again, it will be necessary to relitigate all of this.
Here are his recollections of how he met Jackson for the first time:
25 DIRECT EXAMINATION
26 BY MR. MESEREAU:
27 Q. Mr. Barnes, how old are you?
28 A. I’m 23 years old. 9170
1 Q. Where is your home?
2 A. Melbourne, Australia.
3 Q. And what kind of work do you do?
4 A. Right now I’m unemployed. I actually had to
5 quit my job to come here.
6 Q. Okay. And what job is that?
7 A. I was a roulette dealer at the casino.
8 Q. In Melbourne?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. Okay. Do you know the fellow seated to my
11 right at counsel table?
12 A. Absolutely.
13 Q. Who is he?
14 A. It’s my good friend Michael Jackson.
15 Q. And you say your good friend. How long have
16 you known him?
17 A. Since I was five.
18 Q. How did you meet him?
19 A. I actually — I was a big — well, I was as
20 big a fan as you can be at that age, of his, and he
21 was in Melbourne for the “Bad” tour. And so my mom
22 thought it would be a good idea for us to write a
23 letter. My sister wrote the letter, but put it in
24 my name as if I was writing the letter.
25 And we went to meet him — well, see him at
26 the airport when he touched down. And while we were
27 there, we gave the letter to one of his dancers, and
28 then we left the airport after it was all over. 9171
1 And I’m not sure exactly how much time
2 passed, but after a little while, he — we received
3 a phone call from him, and ever since then we’ve
4 been really good friends.
5 Q. And is he a friend of your family?
6 A. Absolutely.
7 Q. Okay. Have you ever visited Neverland
9 A. Yes, I have.
10 Q. When did you first visit Neverland Ranch?
11 A. It would have been December of ‘91.
12 Q. And do you remember why you visited
14 A. Because he was there, and it’s his house, I
16 Q. Who did you go with?
17 A. My whole family went, my mother and my
18 father and my sister and myself.
19 Q. Did you stay at Neverland?
20 A. Yes, I did.
21 Q. How many times do you think you visited
23 A. Too many to remember. Probably — it would
24 be ten or more, even. More than ten times.
25 Q. And how many times do you think you’ve
26 stayed over at Neverland?
27 A. Every time.
Barnes denied being molested by Jackson or showering with him, and was vehement in his denial:
28 Q. Okay. Did you ever stay in Michael 9172
1 Jackson’s room?
2 A. Yes, I have.
3 Q. How many times do you think you’ve done
5 A. Countless as well.
6 Q. And how would you describe his room?
7 A. It’s big. It’s pretty cool because it’s got
8 lots of fun stuff to do there. Video games, such as
9 stuff like that. And it’s probably the best as I
10 can describe it.
11 Q. Have you ever stayed in Michael Jackson’s
13 A. Yes, I have.
14 Q. How many times do you think you have?
15 A. Countless as well.
16 Q. Has Mr. Jackson ever molested you?
17 A. Absolutely not. And I can tell you right
18 now that if he had, I wouldn’t be here right now.
19 Q. Has Mr. Jackson ever touched you in a sexual
21 A. Never. I wouldn’t stand for it.
22 Q. Has Mr. Jackson ever touched any part of
23 your body in a way that you thought was
25 A. Never. It’s not the type of thing that I
26 would stand for.
27 Q. When you stayed in Mr. Jackson’s bed —
28 A. Uh-huh. 9173
1 Q. — on any of those occasions was anyone else
3 A. Yeah.
4 Q. Who?
5 A. Well, I can’t — see, I was pretty young at
6 the time, so I can’t remember exactly. But I know
7 my sister as being there, his cousins have been
8 there. And — yeah, Macaulay has actually been
9 there as well, Macaulay Culkin. So there’s been a
10 few people.
11 Q. What is the longest period you think you’ve
12 ever stayed at Neverland?
13 A. I couldn’t tell you. I don’t remember
15 Q. Would it be a week, or three days?
16 A. Longer than that.
17 Q. Longer than that?
18 A. Yeah. It would probably be a couple weeks,
19 maybe a month at Neverland at one time.
20 Q. And what do you recall doing at Neverland
21 during the times you stayed there?
22 A. Playing arcade games. Going
23 ATV/motorbike-riding around the property. Going on
24 amusement park rides. And watching plenty of
25 movies, plenty of cartoons. Eating very good food.
26 Q. Do you consider Michael Jackson to be your
27 family friend?
28 A. Absolutely. 9174
1 Q. Do you stay in communication with him?
2 A. Absolutely.
3 Q. And how do you typically communicate with
4 Michael Jackson?
5 A. Like he’s a member of the family. Just
6 always had warm conversations, reminisce about old
8 Q. Are you familiar with a Jacuzzi at
10 A. Yeah.
11 Q. Ever been in the Jacuzzi?
12 A. Yes, I have.
13 Q. Do you recall Michael Jackson ever being in
14 the Jacuzzi with you?
15 A. I don’t recall. He possibly could have, but
16 I don’t really remember.
17 Q. Do you recall ever taking a shower with
18 Michael Jackson?
19 A. Never.
20 Q. Now, have you visited Neverland without your
21 parents being with you?
22 A. Yes.
23 Q. And how many times do you think you’ve done
25 A. It wouldn’t be that many. But I couldn’t
26 give you a ballpark figure even.
27 Q. Now, have you followed this case in the
28 media? 9175
1 A. No, I haven’t.
2 Q. Okay.
3 A. I chose not to.
4 Q. Are you aware of any allegations being made
5 that Mr. Jackson inappropriately touched you when
6 you were with him?
7 A. Yes, I am. And I’m very mad about that.
8 Q. You’re mad about it?
9 A. Yeah.
10 Q. Why?
11 A. Because it’s untrue, and they’re putting my
12 name through the dirt. And I’m really, really,
13 really not happy about it.
14 MR. MESEREAU: No further questions.
Zonen tried to discredit Barnes by implying that he’s too embarrassed to admit that he had been molested, but Judge Melville sustained Mesereau’s objection. Afterwards, Zonen travelled down the beaten path of harassing Barnes about his sleeping in Jackson’s bed:
17 BY MR. ZONEN:
18 Q. Mr. Barnes, do you consider it disgraceful
19 to having been molested?
20 A. Absolutely.
21 Q. All right. And why would it be a disgrace
22 for somebody to have been molested?
23 A. Well, a child is —
24 MR. MESEREAU: Objection. This calls for
25 speculation; foundation.
26 THE COURT: Sustained.
27 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: How old were you when you
28 first started sharing a bed with Michael Jackson? 9176
1 A. Couldn’t tell you. Don’t really remember.
2 Q. How old were you when you first started
3 visiting Michael Jackson?
4 A. When I first started visiting, I was nine.
5 Q. And you visited Neverland with whom?
6 A. With my parents.
7 Q. Both your mother and your father?
8 A. And my sister as well.
9 Q. Your sister as well. And how long did you
10 stay at Neverland?
11 A. The first time?
12 Q. Yes.
13 A. I don’t exactly remember.
14 Q. Did you stay over the week?
15 A. Yeah.
16 Q. Did you then visit Neverland on a regular
17 basis thereafter?
18 A. I wouldn’t say regular, but, yeah, it was
19 quite frequent.
20 Q. Did you visit Neverland at least once a year
22 A. Yeah.
23 Q. And when you visited Neverland, would you
24 always stay with Michael Jackson?
25 A. Yeah, most of the time.
26 Q. All right. Now, I asked you, I believe, the
27 age the first time you went. Did you answer that
28 question? 9177
1 A. Yeah.
2 Q. And you said what? About nine?
3 A. Yeah.
4 Q. Okay. And then you would continue to go
5 each year thereafter?
6 A. Yeah.
7 Q. Did you sometimes go more than once a year?
8 A. Yeah.
9 Q. And would you stay for longer than one week
10 at a time?
11 A. Sometimes, I guess, yeah.
12 Q. Were there occasions where you would stay
13 two or even three weeks?
14 A. I was young at the time, so I don’t really
15 remember the time frames.
16 Q. Okay.
17 A. So it would be purely speculation.
18 Q. Would it have been summer vacation; that is,
19 your summer vacation in Australia?
20 A. I really couldn’t tell you.
21 Q. Did you ever go to Neverland without a
22 parent going with you?
23 A. Yes.
24 Q. So sometimes you would fly all the way from
25 Australia to Neverland, is that right, by yourself?
26 A. Absolutely.
27 Q. Were you much older than nine years old when
28 you did that? 9178
1 A. I couldn’t tell you. But — well, right —
2 yeah, I was older than nine.
3 Q. Did you visit in your tenth year and your
4 eleventh year and your twelfth year as well?
5 A. I really couldn’t tell you that.
6 Q. Did you ever visit in your thirteenth year
7 and your fourteenth year?
8 A. I don’t remember much about ages.
9 Q. You can’t tell us how old you were when you
10 stopped visiting Neverland?
11 A. I still — I continue to visit to this day.
12 Q. Do you still sleep with Michael Jackson?
13 A. No, I don’t.
14 Q. How old were you when you stopped sleeping
15 with Michael Jackson?
16 A. I couldn’t tell you that.
17 Q. Why don’t you still sleep with Michael
19 A. Well, he’s got kids now.
20 Q. And?
21 A. And I — it would be purely speculation if I
22 told you. I could not answer that knowingly,
23 like — it’s just —
24 Q. But during the years that you were visiting
25 Michael Jackson at Neverland, you never stayed
26 anyplace but in his room; is that correct?
27 A. I couldn’t tell you.
28 Q. You’re telling us that you don’t remember if 9179
1 you stayed in a guest lodge by yourself or with your
2 mother or if you shared a bed with Michael Jackson?
3 A. I don’t remember staying in the guest lodge
4 by myself.
5 Q. But it’s true, sir, that you stayed
6 virtually the entire time in his bedroom; is that
8 A. Yeah.
9 Q. And during that time nobody else stayed in
10 the bedroom with you other than you and Michael
11 Jackson; is that true?
12 A. No, that’s not true.
13 Q. On what percentage of the occasions that you
14 visited Michael Jackson was there somebody else
15 staying in that room?
16 A. I couldn’t tell you.
17 Q. Can you tell us the names of the people who
18 stayed in the room with you?
19 A. My sister. Macaulay Culkin. There was
20 Levon and Elijah. There was Frank, Eddie, and
22 Q. Was Frank —
23 A. Prince as well.
24 MR. MESEREAU: Objection, he hasn’t finished
25 the question.
26 THE WITNESS: His son Prince as well.
27 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Prince? Prince is how old
28 now? 9180
1 A. I’m not quite sure.
2 Q. About what, seven?
3 A. Yeah. I guess so.
4 Q. And how old was Prince when he stayed in the
5 room with you and Michael Jackson?
6 A. I think he was three.
7 Q. All right. So it was about four years ago?
8 A. Yeah.
9 Q. So you stayed in the room with Michael
10 Jackson when you were 18 years old?
11 A. Yeah.
12 Q. You’re 22 now?
13 A. 23. 23.
14 Q. So you were 19 years old?
15 A. Yeah, I guess.
16 Q. Did you share a bed with him at that time?
17 A. Yeah, I did.
18 Q. You did. Have you been sharing a bed with
19 him consistently from age nine until age 19?
20 A. What do you mean by “consistent”?
21 Q. Well, in all the times that you visit,
22 predominately do you stay in his room, in his bed?
23 A. Yeah.
24 Q. Did you do it when you were ten years old as
26 A. Yeah.
27 Q. Did you do it when you were 11 years old as
28 well? 9181
1 A. Yes.
2 Q. Most of the times you did it, there was
3 nobody else in the room; is that correct?
4 A. I guess you could say that.
5 Q. Because Macaulay Culkin was only in the room
6 with you once or twice; isn’t that true?
7 A. I couldn’t tell you how many times.
8 Q. Could he have been in the room 20 or 30
10 A. Probably not.
11 Q. So really it’s closer to once or twice; is
12 that right?
13 A. Yeah, I guess so.
14 Q. All right. And your sister stayed there the
15 first time you visited; is that right?
16 A. Not just the first time.
17 Q. Did she stay there the second time?
18 A. I — look, I don’t really remember.
19 Q. Did your sister share a bed with you and
20 Michael Jackson ever?
21 A. I can’t recall.
22 Q. You can’t recall if your sister shared a
24 A. I can’t remember.
25 Q. When did your sister stop visiting
27 A. She still visits to this day.
28 Q. Does she still share a bed with you and 9182
1 Michael Jackson?
2 A. No.
3 Q. When was the last time your sister shared a
4 bed with you and Michael Jackson?
5 A. I couldn’t tell you. I don’t know the exact
6 period of time.
7 Q. Could you have been 15 or 16 years old?
8 A. I couldn’t tell you.
9 Q. Could you have been ten?
10 A. I couldn’t tell.
11 Q. Mr. Barnes, the best you can tell us about
12 when your sister last shared a bed with you and
13 Michael Jackson, you have no idea?
14 A. It’s not something that I think of. What —
15 why would I try and remember that?
16 Q. Is there —
17 A. Why would I think about it?
18 Q. Is there any other 35-year-old man that you
19 slept with when you were ten years old besides
20 Michael Jackson?
21 A. Yes.
22 Q. Who?
23 A. My uncle.
24 Q. All right. A family member.
25 A. Yeah.
26 Q. Who else?
27 A. That would probably be it. I can’t recall
28 any others. 9183
1 Q. All right. Now, with whom do you live at
2 this time?
3 A. My parents and my sister.
4 Q. And both your parents?
5 A. Yeah.
6 Q. And that’s in Australia?
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. All right. Did your father ever visit
9 Neverland with you?
10 A. Yes, he did.
11 Q. When your father visited Neverland with you,
12 where did you stay?
13 A. Both in the guesthouse and both with him.
14 Q. Both in the guesthouse and with Mr. Jackson?
15 A. I stayed with Mr. Jackson, yeah.
16 Q. Did you ever have a conversation with your
17 father about the propriety of sharing a bed with a
18 35-year-old man?
19 A. Not that I recall.
20 Q. Did you ever have a conversation with your
21 mother about that, whether that was a wise thing to
22 do, to share a bed with a 35-year-old man?
23 A. Not that I recall.
Barnes also denied ever being shown pornographic material by Jackson, and knowing that Jackson possessed this material in the first place!
24 Q. Did he ever show you any sexually explicit
26 A. Absolutely not.
27 MR. MESEREAU: Objection; beyond the scope.
28 THE COURT: Overruled. The answer is, 9184
1 “Absolutely not.”
2 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Were you aware that he
3 possessed sexually explicit material?
4 A. No.
Here are questions about his trips with Jackson and the attire he wore whenever he slept in Jackson’s bed; Barnes stated that both he and Jackson always wore pajamas, which is contrary to the media’s myth that Jackson slept naked with young children.
5 Q. Did you ever travel with Michael Jackson
7 A. Yes, I did.
8 Q. Where?
9 A. South America, North America, Africa, and
11 Q. On those occasions —
12 A. And Australia as well, I’m sorry.
13 Q. On those occasions did you share a bed with
15 A. Yes.
16 Q. Were any other people present while you were
17 in the room with him?
18 A. I don’t recall. I can’t — I can’t
20 Q. Was your mother with you when you traveled
21 through South America?
22 A. I think so.
23 Q. You think so?
24 A. Look, when I was young, I wasn’t really
25 thinking about this sort of stuff. I wasn’t trying
26 to retain in my memory this sort of stuff. And
27 what’s sad is that I traveled to all these countries
28 and I really don’t remember much of them. So it’s 9185
1 all sort of — it’s all sort of meshed into one.
2 Q. Mr. Barnes, how old were you when you
3 traveled through South America with Mr. Jackson?
4 A. To tell the truth, I cannot remember.
5 Q. You can’t tell whether you were 19 or 10?
6 A. Well, I wasn’t 19. It was in my middle
7 teens, maybe — no, it would have been in my
8 early — early teens.
9 Q. 12?
10 A. It could have been possibly 12.
11 Q. So you were 12 or 13. You don’t know if
12 your mother was there with you when you traveled
13 through South America?
14 A. She was, actually.
15 Q. In fact, you traveled quite a bit with Mr.
16 Jackson without your mother being present; isn’t
17 that true?
18 A. No.
19 Q. Did you travel through North America with
20 Mr. Jackson without your mother?
21 A. Yes.
22 Q. And in how many cities through North America
23 did you go without your mother and Mr. Jackson?
24 A. I’m not too sure.
25 Q. Six or seven, perhaps eight?
26 A. I couldn’t tell you.
27 Q. Was he performing at the time, Mr. Jackson?
28 A. For which? 9186
1 Q. On the trip through North America, was he
3 A. No, he wasn’t.
4 Q. Did you travel with him when he was
6 A. Yes.
7 Q. Was that — in South America, was he
8 performing then?
9 A. Yes.
10 Q. And every night after the performance, you
11 would go with him to his room; is that correct?
12 A. Yes.
13 Q. And you stayed in his bed that night?
14 A. Yep.
15 Q. In North America when you traveled, your
16 mother was not there?
17 A. Not — well, see, she went to some cities,
18 like we all went to some cities, and sometimes we —
19 I went. Like on some of the occasions when I was
20 gone, coming over here alone, we’d go around. But
21 sometimes when my whole family was there, we’d go
22 around, too.
23 Q. How many times did you come to the United
24 States by yourself?
25 A. Probably only two or three maybe.
26 Q. And did Mr. Jackson arrange for that to
28 A. He arranged for all of our trips. 9187
1 Q. So all of the transportation for you and
2 your family from Australia to Neverland; is that
4 A. Yeah.
5 Q. And then all the travels that you did
6 through the United States and through South America?
7 A. Uh-huh. I was very fortunate.
8 Q. I’m sorry?
9 A. I was very fortunate.
10 Q. When you slept with Mr. Jackson, what
11 generally did you wear?
12 A. Sorry?
13 Q. When you slept with Mr. Jackson in the same
14 bed, what would you wear?
15 A. Pajama pants, T-shirt, pajama top sometimes.
16 Q. Always?
17 A. Well, always pajama pants, always a T-shirt.
18 Q. And Mr. Jackson?
19 A. Exactly the same thing.
20 Q. Always pajamas and pajama bottoms?
21 A. Uh-huh.
Next, Zonen asked Barnes to identify a series of photos of him and Jackson together in the early 1990’s:
22 Q. I’d like to show you a series of photographs
23 and tell me if you recognize them, the people in
24 this photo. Let’s start with 893.
25 A. Yep.
26 Q. Who’s that?
27 A. That’s me and him.
28 Q. Are these Polaroids? 9188
1 A. They look so.
2 Q. Do you remember taking these pictures?
3 A. Not at all.
4 Q. Do you remember where you were?
5 A. Not at all.
6 Q. Can you tell us about how old you were?
7 A. Probably about 11 maybe, 10.
8 Q. I notice you’ve changed your hairstyle since
9 then, haven’t you?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. You were about nine or ten.
12 So this was early on in your meeting with
13 Mr. Jackson; is that right?
14 A. Yeah, I would say so.
15 Q. All right. This is 893, and that has two
16 photos on the front, and two photos on the back; is
17 that right?
18 A. Yep.
19 Q. And that’s you in the two photos in the back
20 as well?
21 A. Yep.
22 Q. All right. 892, is that you as well?
23 A. Yep.
24 Q. And Mr. Jackson?
25 A. Yep. Yep.
26 Q. And the two on the back? Do these appear to
27 have been taken at the same time?
28 A. These? 9189
1 Q. Yes.
2 A. Yeah, I’d say so.
3 Q. 891, who is that?
4 A. That’s Michael Jackson.
5 Q. Did you take those pictures?
6 A. Couldn’t tell you.
7 Q. They appear to have been taken at the same
8 time; no?
9 A. Possibly.
10 Q. All right. If I were to tell you that they
11 were all found together, would that suggest that
12 they were all taken at the same time?
13 MR. MESEREAU: Objection; calls for
15 THE COURT: Sustained.
16 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Turn it over, if you would,
17 to the back side. Three more pictures on the back.
18 What are they?
19 A. Of Michael Jackson.
20 Q. Do you remember those pictures?
21 A. Not at all.
22 Q. Does that look familiar to you?
23 A. No.
24 Q. Mr. Barnes, did you take those photographs?
25 A. I couldn’t tell you. I don’t — I couldn’t
26 tell you, no.
27 Q. 890, two pictures on the front. Would you
28 take a look at those two pictures? 9190
1 A. Uh-huh.
2 Q. One of those is you; is that right?
3 A. Yes, it is.
4 Q. You appear to be in bed.
5 A. Uh-huh.
6 Q. The other picture is what?
7 A. Appears to be Michael Jackson.
8 Q. And he’s in his underwear; is that right?
9 A. Yes, it is.
10 Q. 889, is that you?
11 A. Yes, it is.
12 Q. And anything on the back?
13 A. Yep.
14 Q. Is that you as well?
15 A. Yes, it is.
16 Q. All right. Do you remember those pictures?
17 A. Don’t remember taking them, but I can tell
18 you where they were taken.
19 Q. Where?
20 A. They were taken at the ranch.
21 Q. They were taken at the ranch?
22 A. In a photo booth.
23 Q. There’s a photo booth at the ranch on that
24 one there?
25 A. Yep.
26 Q. Do you recognize the background on any of
27 the other photographs?
28 A. On these? 9191
1 Q. Yes.
2 A. No, I don’t. No.
3 Q. Are all of these photographs accurate
4 photographs of the subjects depicted within? In
5 other words, the photographs of Mr. Jackson really
6 are Mr. Jackson and the photographs of you really
7 are you?
8 A. That one’s a bit sketchy, but the rest,
10 Q. The one in his underwear?
11 A. Yeah.
12 Q. You’re not sure that’s him?
13 A. Well, you can’t really see the face
After being questioned about the declaration that he signed, Barnes was shown additional photos of him and Jackson. Notice how Zonen once again questioned Barnes about the hairstyle that he had at that time; this was an attempt by the prosecution to assert to the jury that Jackson had a certain “type” of boy that he liked:
15 Q. Mr. Barnes, before coming from Australia,
16 did you speak with anybody about your testimony?
17 A. No.
18 Q. They simply flew you from Australia to
20 A. Well, they explained that I’d be a witness.
21 Q. And then they interviewed you after you got
23 A. The interview?
24 Q. Yes. You had an interview with an
25 investigator —
26 A. Yes.
27 Q. — who works for Mr. Mesereau; is that
28 right? 9192
1 A. Yes.
2 Q. And that interview took place after you got
3 to California?
4 A. Yes, it did.
5 Q. So they had no way of knowing what you were
6 going to say while you were still in Australia?
7 A. No.
8 Q. Because they never talked with you at all?
9 A. Not about the case, not being a witness. I
10 signed a declaration.
11 Q. You signed a declaration from where?
12 A. From — I was at home. Melbourne,
14 Q. Melbourne, Australia?
15 A. Yeah.
16 Q. All right. So somebody wrote a declaration
17 and they sent it to you, is that right, in
19 A. Faxed it.
20 Q. I’m sorry?
21 A. Faxed it.
22 Q. They faxed it you. But you had to have
23 talked to somebody to tell them what to put in the
24 declaration, didn’t you do that?
25 A. Yes, I did.
26 Q. So you did talk with somebody while you were
27 in Australia?
28 A. Yes. 9193
1 Q. Who was the person that you talked with
2 while you were in Australia?
3 A. It was Brian Oxman and some — I think it
4 might be Scott Ross as well. But I’m not exactly
6 Q. And then they prepared a declaration, they
7 sent it to you; is that correct?
8 A. That’s correct.
9 MR. ZONEN: Madam Clerk, could I have
10 another sticker that says….
11 Q. Let me show you 894, four photographs on it.
12 MR. MESEREAU: Excuse me, Counsel. Are
13 these what I saw before? Are these what you showed
14 me earlier?
15 MR. ZONEN: Not the first set. Let me show
17 Q. 893, would you take a look at that, please,
18 both sides of that?
19 A. Yep.
20 Q. That contains a total of six pictures, two
21 on one side, four on the back; is that right?
22 A. That’s correct.
23 Q. And those are all pictures of you, one
24 picture of Mr. Jackson?
25 A. Correct.
26 Q. 894?
27 A. Uh-huh.
28 Q. That’s who? 9194
1 A. Michael Jackson.
2 Q. All four of those pictures?
3 A. Correct.
4 Q. Do you recognize the location?
5 A. No, I don’t.
6 Q. You have no recollection of that?
7 A. No.
8 Q. Could that have been a hotel you stayed in?
9 A. Quite possibly.
10 Q. All right. 896?
11 A. Uh-huh.
12 Q. Does any of that look familiar to you?
13 A. Is this New York? I don’t remember any of
14 these pictures.
15 Q. Do you remember any of those pictures being
17 A. Not at all.
18 Q. And your age, approximately, in those
20 A. I would have absolutely no idea.
21 Q. You would have no idea at all?
22 A. Well, these ones of me?
23 Q. Yes. You.
24 A. Probably about the same age.
25 Q. Okay. Does it appear that those photographs
26 were taken about the same time?
27 A. Purely speculation, but, yes.
28 Q. Is your hairstyle the same as – 9195
1 MR. MESEREAU: Objection; move to strike.
2 THE COURT: Stricken. Speculation.
3 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Based on your familiarity
4 with yourself, does it appear that you are about the
5 same age in each of the photographs so far shown to
7 A. Yes.
8 Q. And all those photographs are you with
9 Michael Jackson in a room someplace; is that right?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. You have no recollection of when those
12 photographs were taken?
13 A. Absolutely not.
14 Q. And the pictures of Mr. Jackson, you have no
15 recollection of actually taking those yourself?
16 A. Absolutely not.
17 Q. Were there many occasions, when you were ten
18 years old, that you traveled by yourself with Mr.
20 A. I wouldn’t say — well, I’m not sure I
21 understand the question.
22 Q. Did you travel more than one trip with Mr.
23 Jackson when you were about the age of 10 by
25 A. Do you mean from my home?
26 Q. Yes.
27 A. Around?
28 I can’t really remember. I can’t remember 9196
1 how many times. It might have been one, might have
2 been two. I can’t really tell you.
3 Q. On the occasions when you traveled with Mr.
4 Jackson and he was on tour, did you go to all of the
6 A. I’m not sure.
7 Q. Was there ever a woman traveling with Mr.
8 Jackson while you were traveling with him?
9 A. A woman?
10 Q. Yes.
11 A. I’m not — what do you mean, though?
12 Q. Somebody with whom he was close to. I don’t
13 mean an assistant. I mean a friend or a girlfriend.
14 A. Not that I recall.
15 Q. At the time that you were traveling with him
16 in South America, was he ever traveling with a
17 woman? And I don’t mean an assistant. A
19 MR. MESEREAU: Object as beyond the scope.
20 THE COURT: Sustained.
21 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Were there ever any other
22 people traveling with you as part of your unit?
23 A. Where?
24 Q. When you traveled.
25 A. Sometimes.
26 Q. Did any of them sleep in the same room with
27 you and Mr. Jackson?
28 A. I can’t really recall. I don’t remember. 9197
1 Q. Did anyone ever share a bed with you and Mr.
2 Jackson, where there were three of you in the same
3 bed together?
4 A. Can’t really remember.
5 Q. Did your sister ever sleep with you in the
6 same bed and Mr. Jackson?
7 A. Unfortunately, I can’t really remember that
9 Q. Do you know Wade Robson?
10 A. Yes.
11 Q. How well do you know Wade Robson?
12 A. Not very.
13 Q. Have you kept up some kind of friendship
14 with Mr. Robson?
15 A. Nope.
16 Q. Is that a “no”?
17 A. That’s a “no.”
18 Q. When was the last time you spoke with Mr.
20 A. Today.
21 Q. All right. Today you saw him. When was the
22 last time prior to today?
23 A. Yesterday.
24 Q. Okay. So you’ve been staying at Neverland,
25 have you?
26 A. Yes.
27 Q. Did you have an opportunity to talk with Mr.
28 Robson? 9198
1 A. I had an opportunity, yeah. Yeah.
2 Q. And did you speak with Mr. Robson?
3 A. Yes.
4 Q. Did you discuss your testimony?
5 A. Absolutely not.
6 Q. And why not?
7 A. Because it was explained to us that we were
8 not allowed to.
9 Q. Who was that who told you that?
10 A. The lawyers did.
11 Q. Did they say why you weren’t allowed to?
12 A. Isn’t it against the law?
13 Q. Is that what they told you, it was illegal
14 to talk with each other?
15 A. No, they didn’t. They just explained that
16 it wasn’t — they just said, “Don’t talk about the
18 Q. Were you aware of Wade Robson spending long
19 periods of time with Michael Jackson?
20 MR. MESEREAU: Objection. Beyond the scope;
22 THE COURT: Sustained.
Once again, Zonen tried to focus on the prosecution’s assertion that Jackson emphasized “trust” and “family” to woo his young victims and gain the confidence of their parents, but Barnes denied hearing those terms from Jackson very often.
Afterwards, Zonen grilled Barnes about his knowledge of any other children who slept in Jackson’s bed, and ended his cross examination shortly thereafter. Mesereau declined to redirect examine Barnes, and the court adjourned for the day.
23 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Did Michael Jackson ever
24 speak to you about other boys who spent nights with
25 him in his room?
26 MR. MESEREAU: Objection. Beyond the scope;
27 relevance; foundation.
28 THE COURT: Sustained. 9199
1 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Did you ever talk with
2 Michael Jackson about the propriety of sharing a bed
3 with him?
4 MR. MESEREAU: Objection. Beyond the scope;
5 foundation; and relevance.
6 THE COURT: Overruled.
7 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Go ahead and answer the
9 A. Not that I recall.
10 Q. At no time did you ever have a conversation
11 with Michael Jackson where the subject of the
12 conversation was whether or not you should be
13 sharing a bed with him?
14 A. Not that I recall.
15 Q. Did he ever tell you that you were like
16 family to him?
17 A. All the time.
18 Q. All the time. Did he ever tell you that you
19 should trust him?
20 A. Yeah.
21 Q. Did he ever tell you that he was like a
22 father to you?
23 A. He may have, yes.
24 Q. Did he ever tell you that he considered you
25 to be like a son to him?
26 A. Yes.
27 Q. Was that something he frequently said to
28 you? 9200
1 A. Not frequently.
2 Q. Was that something that he frequently said
3 to you during the early stages of your relationship
4 when you were about age eight?
5 A. Never met him when I was age eight.
6 Q. You were about nine?
7 A. Yeah.
8 Q. Okay. So how long after you had begun
9 visiting Neverland did Mr. Jackson speak to you in
10 such terms, tell you you were like family to him or
11 like a son to him?
12 A. I couldn’t tell you.
13 Q. Did he ever have a conversation with your
14 mother of that nature, tell your mother that he
15 considered her to be like family to him as well?
16 A. Wouldn’t have a clue.
17 Q. That was never done in your presence?
18 A. Possibly. I don’t remember.
19 Q. Did your mother ever have a conversation
20 with him about anything in your presence?
21 A. Quite possibly.
22 Q. Is it the case that when you were kids and
23 running around Neverland, on occasion you would get
24 fairly rowdy?
25 A. Nope.
26 Q. You were always fairly well disciplined and
28 A. I was brought up right. 9201
1 Q. How about the other kids who were at
2 Neverland while you were there?
3 A. As far as I remember, yeah, we were all
4 pretty — there were a couple maybe, but I never
5 really saw an outbreak.
6 Q. You never saw what?
7 A. An outbreak.
8 Q. An outbreak?
9 Who were the other boys who were there about
10 the time that you were there?
11 A. I saw Mac there, Macaulay Culkin. His —
12 Levon and Elijah. Frank, Eddie, Dominick —
13 Q. How old was Frank at the time?
14 MR. MESEREAU: Objection. He hasn’t
15 finished his answer yet, Your Honor.
16 THE COURT: Sustained.
17 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: Go ahead.
18 A. Aldo. Marie Nicole. My sister, of course.
19 That’s all I really remember.
20 Q. Of the ones that you’ve mentioned, how many
21 of them shared Michael Jackson’s bedroom while you
22 were there?
23 A. All of them have.
24 Q. Did — all of them?
25 A. I’m pretty sure.
26 Q. On how many nights do you think, all at the
27 same time?
28 A. Not at the same time, because like one trip 9202
1 we’d see — we saw Mac, and the other trips we saw
2 everyone else.
3 Q. And would they share the same bed with you
4 and Mr. Jackson?
5 A. I can’t honestly recall that.
6 Q. Do you remember any of those people who you
7 just mentioned sharing a bed with Mr. Jackson in
8 your presence?
9 A. Yeah.
10 Q. Who?
11 A. Mac.
12 Q. Macaulay Culkin?
13 A. Yeah.
14 Q. Who else?
15 A. Frank.
16 Q. Frank Cascio?
17 A. Yeah.
18 Q. How old was Frank Cascio at the time?
19 MR. MESEREAU: Objection. He hasn’t
20 finished his answer yet.
21 THE WITNESS: Eddie.
22 THE COURT: I can’t tell if he has or not.
23 Have you finished your answer?
24 THE WITNESS: No, I haven’t.
25 THE COURT: Go ahead.
26 THE WITNESS: Eddie. That’s probably —
27 that’s all I can recall.
28 Q. BY MR. ZONEN: “Eddie” is Eddie who? 9203
1 A. Cascio.
2 Q. That’s Frank’s brother?
3 A. Yeah.
4 Q. How old was Frank at that time?
5 A. Wouldn’t be able to tell you.
6 Q. Well, was he a child?
7 A. I never knew him as a child. He’s — he’s
8 older than me, so….
9 Q. You only know Frank Cascio as an adult?
10 A. No. He’s like a year older, two years older
11 than me.
12 Q. You said you never knew him as a child?
13 A. Well, as a child, I consider to be under the
14 age of 10.
15 Q. How about as a young teenager?
16 A. Yeah.
17 Q. So you saw him there as a young teenager?
18 A. Yeah.
19 Q. Would he share Michael Jackson’s bed as
21 A. If I recall correctly, yeah.
22 Q. And Eddie, how old was Eddie during that
24 A. Like he’s — it would have been a young
25 teenager as well.
26 Q. What’s the longest period of time that any
27 of those people stayed in Michael Jackson’s room
28 while you were there? In other words, how many 9204
1 consecutive days did that happen?
2 A. Can’t recall properly.
3 Q. Did Michael Jackson ever tell you that he
4 loved you?
5 A. Yeah, all the time.
6 Q. Did he ever touch you?
7 A. In what manner?
8 Q. Did he ever kiss you?
9 A. On the cheek, on the forehead, yeah.
10 Q. Often?
11 A. I wouldn’t say often, but, yeah. I’ve —
12 I can’t really remember these things. It’s not
13 something that would — you know, I would try to
15 MR. ZONEN: I have no further questions.
16 MR. MESEREAU: I have no further questions,
17 Your Honor.
18 THE COURT: All right. Thank you. You may
19 step down.
20 I think we’ll start the next witness
22 (To the jury) I’ll see you tomorrow at
23 8:30. Remember the admonition. Have a good
25 (The proceedings adjourned at 2:30 p.m.)
Summary of Brett Barnes’ testimony
1. Barnes began his testimony by describing how he met Jackson after having a letter delivered to him, and subsequently receiving a phone call from Jackson and being invited to visit Neverland with his family. He denied ever being molested by Jackson, or showering with him (thus refuting the testimony of former Neverland employees Ralph Chacon and Adrian McManus).
2. Under cross examination, Zonen tried to discredit Barnes by implying that he’s too embarrassed to admit that he had been molested, but Judge Melville sustained Mesereau’s objection. Afterwards, Zonen travelled down the beaten path of harassing Barnes about his sleeping in Jackson’s bed. Barnes asserted that he was never coerced into sleeping in Jackosn’s room, but rather he chose to sleep there on his own volition.
3. Barnes also denied bein shown pornography by Jackson; in fact, he wasn’t even aware that Jackson owned pornography!
4. As the cross examination went on, Zonen tried to focus on the prosecution’s assertion that Jackson emphasized “trust” and “family” to woo his young victims and gain the confidence of their parents, but Barnes denied hearing those terms from Jackson very often. Afterwards, Zonen grilled Barnes about his knowledge of any other children who slept in Jackson’s bed, and ended his cross examination shortly thereafter. Mesereau declined to redirect examine Barnes, and the court adjourned for the day.
On May 8th, 2013, the day that Wade Robson’s false allegations against Jackson became public, Brett Barnes tweeted the following:
Any fans who had any doubts about Barnes’ defending Jackson until his last breath were easily put to rest.